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08 Nov 01 - 07:35 PM (#588614) Subject: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: Desert Dancer I've just today been working on a song from Jeff Davis, "Pat Do This," (a modal "working on the railway" kind of song) which he says was collected by Maud Karpeles in Nelson County Virginia in the 1950's. Anyone have information on where material from that expedition is published? Journals only, or any texts? ~ Becky in Tucson |
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08 Nov 01 - 08:00 PM (#588643) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: Allan C. You might find what you want by doing a search here for some of the books she was associated with, including those of Cecil Sharp. |
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08 Nov 01 - 08:31 PM (#588667) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: Mudlark Probably of no help at all but there is a karpeles museum in Santa Barbara, CA.... |
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09 Nov 01 - 12:22 AM (#588771) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: Desert Dancer Allan, a good thought, though it doesn't pan out. My local university library on-line catalog doesn't show anything, either. Maybe they're recordings in the Library of Congress or the EFDSS library. I 'spose I could write Jeff and ask where he picked up that particular one. Mudlark, I assume the namesake (and subject) of the museum is no relation?? ~ Becky in Tucson |
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09 Nov 01 - 12:13 PM (#589033) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: GUEST,MCP The published books seem to be only the Newfoundland Songs (and editing the Sharp English Folk Songs from the Southern Appalachians). However in the introduction to the 1951 edition of EFSfSA she starts off with "In the Summer of 1951, with the assistance of the Library of Congress, I spent three-and-a-half weeks in the mountains of Virginia, North Carolina, and Tennessee, accompanied by Mrs. Sidney Robertson Cowell. With a tape-recording machine lent by the Library we recorded ninety-one songs and instrumental tunes, of which sixty-nine were from singers who had previously sung to Cecil Sharp of from near relations of these singer". The notes to record The Doc Watson Family Tradition quote the following: " ""Thus, a song originating in England and carried to America, lives there by oral tradition for some hundreds of years; it is written down and taken back to England by Cecil Sharp; then some thirty years later the song is carried back in printed form to the country of its adoption and takes on a new lease of life. Such are the devious ways of tradition."" -Maud Karpeles
With these words, Maud Karpeles reflected on the erosion of oral tradition in the Southern Appalachians where she collected in 1951, revisiting sixty-nine families and individuals whom Sharp had first met between 1916 and 1918. In the ensuing years, many of these singers of Virginia, North Carolina and Tennessee had forgotten their own songs and were delighted to relearn them from the publicised transcriptions which she and Sharp had made thirty years earlier."
The Library of Congress site might be a good place to look next since they appeared to have sponsored the trip. (If I have some time over the weekend I might have a look myself!).
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09 Nov 01 - 12:44 PM (#589047) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: Desert Dancer Thanks, Mick, sounds like they must be at the Library of Congress, although an on-line catalog search there under her name didn't bring anything useful up. I suppose the thing to do is check with Jeff D. and contact the Center for American Folklife at the LOC directly with the inquiry. ~ Becky in Tucson but keeping this thread going in case anyone's got the inside scoop! |
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09 Nov 01 - 02:04 PM (#589093) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: Malcolm Douglas Maud Karpeles published a short piece, A Return Visit to the Appalachian Mountains, in the Journal of the English Folk Dance and Song Society (vol.6, no.3, 1951) describing her three-and-a-half week trip. Some 50 of the singers recorded by her and Cecil Sharp had died or disappeared, but she managed to find 31 (original singers or their near relatives), and recorded material from a further 5 singers and instrumentalists. 34 of the songs had been noted on the previous trip, and published in English Folk Songs from the Southern Appalachians (1932), but at the time of writing she had not had the opportunity of transcribing the new recordings to see exactly how they had changed over the intervening years. The article included transcriptions of four songs not previously noted; The Gypsy Laddie, from Mrs. Donald Shelton (née Emma Hensley); The Cruel Ship's Carpenter from Mrs. Charlie Noel of Hot Springs, N.C.; Rock-a-Bye Baby and Down in the Meadow from Mrs. Oscar Allen (née Ada Maddox) of Lynchburg, Va. If you'd like a copy of the article, let me know. |
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09 Nov 01 - 06:39 PM (#589324) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: Desert Dancer Hmm. The University of Arizona doesn't have volumes 4-6, of course. I may be in touch, Malcolm. ~ Becky in Tucson |
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10 Nov 01 - 05:03 AM (#589594) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: GUEST,MCP I note from the EFDSS site, under the Journal entry, that Vol 8 No.1 (2001) contains an article by David Atkinson (who was also responsible for the Introductory bibliography to English Folk Song on the site) on The Maud Karpeles' Collection. Mick PS. I agree that the Library of Congress turn up nothing very useful searching for Maud Karpeles, but Cowell turns up a lot of results - I haven't looked through them but it might be worth a closer look. Mick. |
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10 Nov 01 - 11:33 AM (#589679) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: Malcolm Douglas Thanks for pointing that out, Mick. I hadn't read that article yet, but on referring to it, it makes clear that Karpeles' papers -with the exception of the Newfoundland material, which went to Memorial University of Newfoundland- were bequeathed to EFDSS for the Vaughan Williams Memorial Library (which now also has microfiche copies of the Newfoundland papers). The documents are catalogued according to the boxes into which Miss Karpeles sorted them before her death, and Box 6 contains her diaries from the 1950 Appalachian trip, and lists of singers and songs; there is also some material from 1955. It isn't clear from David Atkinson's summary whether song transcriptions from that expedition are included in this or in other boxes. It appears that some of the sound recordings were released on disc by the BBC; the VWML has copies, at any rate, as does The National Sound Archive, where you can get details online. It would seem reasonable to suppose that the Library of Congress might have the original tapes, or copies of them, but at this point Peter Kennedy, Maud Karpeles' nephew and a prolific collector in his own right, enters the equation. It certainly looks as if he has the tapes, or some of them (and knowing a little about him, I shouldn't be surprised if they were the originals). He runs Folktrax, as you may know, and has two anthologies of material from the 1950 trip available for sale (cassette or CD): FTX-907 - BLACK IS THE COLOUR: Appalachian Collection -1 (Tennessee and N.Carolina) FTX-908 - CUMBERLAND GAP: Maud's Appalachian Collection -2 (Virginia ballads and dance tunes) |
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10 Nov 01 - 07:22 PM (#589937) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: Desert Dancer Wow. Thanks, guys. ~ B in T |
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10 Nov 01 - 07:33 PM (#589946) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: Desert Dancer Kennedy seems to be the easiest source, and there's "Pat Do This and Pat Do That" on the Cumberland Gap set. This looks like a banjo-intensive set of things, and Jeff Davis being a great one for getting in touch with source material on the instrument, I bet this is where he picked it up. Now I have to decide if I want to deal with Mr. Kennedy, myself... But thank you, thank you for your ferreting skills, Mick & Malcolm. ~ Becky in Tucson |
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10 Nov 01 - 09:22 PM (#590030) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: GUEST,dick greenhaus Anything listed at Folktrax, Peter Kennedy's site, is available from CAMSCO (800/548-FOLK) for the same price as Mr. Kennedy charges, but with a lot less fuss (currency exchange, overseas shipping. CAMSCO, unlike Folktrax, accepts credit cards. |
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01 May 16 - 06:33 AM (#3788084) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: GUEST,debra hello, I am really looking for this recorded material, to no avail. I know this is an old thread, but really important to me. anyone have any luck getting the recordings? thank you, ~debra |
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01 May 16 - 09:06 AM (#3788103) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: GUEST,Mike Yates Copies of the Maud Karpeles Appalachian recordings are housed in the Vaughan Williams Library at Cecil Shjarp House, London. |
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01 May 16 - 09:17 AM (#3788108) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: Jim Carroll Guest Debra PM me (or contact Joe Offer) Sorry, not happy about putting my contact address up Jim Carroll |
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19 Jun 17 - 08:43 AM (#3861708) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: GUEST,Mike Yates Many of Maud Karpeles' Appalachian recordings can be heard on a forthcoming Musical Traditions 2 CD set "When Cecil Left the Mountains". This should be available by the end of this month (June, 2017). Further details on www.mustrad.org.uk - editorial page. |
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19 Jun 17 - 05:41 PM (#3861797) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: nickp Ooo, that's one to buy! |
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20 Jun 17 - 05:38 PM (#3862007) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: Brian Peters Looks like a great project. Those recordings of MK's have been hard-to-find for way too long, and there's some very interesting stuff there, both unaccompanied balladry and string band music. Any chance of a modification to the thread title to reflect the new release, Joe? |
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21 Jun 17 - 04:20 AM (#3862077) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: GUEST,Mike Yates Brian, I was planning to send details for a new thread once the CD set was issued. |
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28 May 18 - 10:48 PM (#3927713) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: Desert Dancer Brian Peters' lengthy and detailed review/overview here. I missed this announcement last summer! Glad to have stumbled back on it. ~ Becky in Long Beach |
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29 May 18 - 06:31 AM (#3927756) Subject: RE: Help: Info on Maud Karpeles in U.S. in '50s From: Jim Carroll I have always wondered whether ther was any substance to the story circulating around C# House at one time that Maud's Newfoundland collection owes its existent to the fact that she "took off" with a Newfoundland sailor for a short period Jim Carroll |