DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread

25 Jul 02 - 07:26 AM (#754310)
Subject: Attribution added: DT authors
From: GUEST,Philippa

This is an edited PermaThread©, and all messages posted here are subject to editing and deletion.
This thread is intended to serve as a forum for corrections and annotations for songwriter attributions in the Digital Tradition Folk Song Database.
-Joe Offer-

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Several songs in the DT which have known authors are lacking attribution, although often this has been added to discussion threads. Perhaps if we have a thread specifically dedicated to filling in details of authors, composers and copywrite; Dick & Susan and co. will refer to it next time they update the Digital Tradition.

Messages will be moved here to thread 71227 (click) after they are recorded.

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25 Jul 02 - 04:31 PM (#754566)
Subject: RE: Attribution added: DT authors
From: dick greenhaus

Hi- Excellent idea. I'll go you on better--I'll ask Joe to make it a permathread, so I can't miss it. BTW, if I have a mangled transcription, please feel free to send a correction. I don't speak Irish, so I'm at the mercy of contributors.

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Good idea, Dick. Philippa, I hope you don't mind this being changed to an edited thread.
-Joe Offer-

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10 Jun 10 - 07:00 PM (#2925047)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

Take a look at Will McLean's Hold Back the Waters
filename[ HOLDBACK

It's missing the first verse. You'll find corrected lyrics in THIS MESSAGE (CLICK)

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19 Jun 10 - 09:44 PM (#2931314)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

Note He's Gone Away
filename[ HESGONE

I see one typo:
And you will kiss mg ruby lips when you come back!

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My Love Is Like a Red, Red Rose
filename[ REDREDRO
note the zeroes in the first stanza - they should be replaced by the letter "O"

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Take a look at this message - it corrects typographical errors in "The Echo Mocks the Corncrake," filename[ CORNCRK

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Take a look at "Sourkraut" filename[ SRKRAUT
It's nice to have the lyrics from Jean Thomas, but did she really spell it "sourkraut"? At the very least, the proper spelling should be included in the song notes, so it can be found by searching. There's a thread on the song here (click). I ordered a copy of the Jean Thomas book today (2 July), so I'll post the corrected lyrics when I get them.

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I made a few corrections on Gordon Bok's "Herring Croon"
filename[ HERRCRON
You'll find corrected lyrics in this message

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Take a look at "Ringsend Rose" - filename[ RINGSEND
Songwriter is Pete St. John
also, what appears to be the second verse is the chorus (And there she goes...)

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29 Jul 10 - 02:39 PM (#2954631)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Jim Dixon

The song that is called GOODBYE in the DT (GOODBY), with no attribution, is actually GOOD-BYE-EE by R. P. Weston & Bert Lee.

Also, the DT has only verse 1 and the chorus. Verses 1-3 and the chorus are given here and verse 4 is given here.

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Complete song (Joe)

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18 Sep 10 - 05:32 PM (#2989388)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

Very little thing on Tell Old Bill
filename[ OLDBILL

verses three and four need to be separated

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16 Nov 10 - 04:12 PM (#3033810)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

THE BALLAD OF F.D.R
filename[ BALLDFDR

are the same song. They have identical lyrics, except that filename[ BALLFDR2 has one additional verse at the end - and filename[ BALLDFDR has an explanatory note.

I'd suggest the two be combined, including both titles, the additional verse, and the explanatory note. BALLFDR2 is a far better transcription, although the words are more-or-less the same in both entries.

I highly doubt that the "Oct 16" song actually goes under both of these titles. The Bear Family Songs for Political Action box set has an entirely different song titled "The Ballad of F.D.R." - you'll find it in this thread (click)

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16 Feb 11 - 04:53 PM (#3096713)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Desert Dancer

The WRAGGLE TAGGLE GYPSIES (DT #7180) lyrics, tune, and notes were taken from "Fireside Book of Folk Songs", Edited by Margaret Bradford Boni, published by Simon & Schuster, 1947

~ Becky in Tucson

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18 Feb 11 - 11:46 PM (#3098434)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Jim Dixon

Robbie Wilson, who posted a message here
http://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=135736
had a couple of lyric corrections for the song JOHNNY MCGORY by Pete St. John, filename[ JHNMCGRY
Robbie says verse 2 line 1 should read:
"Up to the Gloucester Diamond, Red Biddy on your mind"

The Gloucester Diamond is a neighbourhood in Dublin; Red Biddy was a cheap red wine.

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22 Feb 11 - 10:12 PM (#3100799)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Jim Dixon

YOU GENTLEMEN OF HIGH REKNOWN filename[ REYNFOX2

"Reknown" is a misspelling. It should be "renown."

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18 Apr 11 - 11:49 AM (#3137462)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Jim Dixon

DIESEL ON MY TAIL (DSLTAIL) was written by Jim Fagan, and recorded by Jim & Jesse. Corrected lyrics are posted here.

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05 May 11 - 04:50 PM (#3148792)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

MtheGM says:

All Around My Hat (I Will Wear the Green Willow) [filename[ ROUNDHAT] is the traditional version of the song, and yet it bears a duplicate of the notes for the Steeleye Span version [filename[ RONDHAT5], which is quite a different song.

It would be nice to have attribution for the traditional lyrics, or at least delete the misleading Steeleye Span reference.

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05 May 11 - 11:17 PM (#3148982)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: MGM·Lion

See my note on thread on this subject, Joe, suggesting Brian Peters as person to consult. He sang the ROUNDHAT version most movingly at the Bob Copper Memorial Concert a few years ago, IIRC.

~Michael~

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11 May 11 - 06:32 PM (#3152379)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

The DT version of the "Old Settler's Song or Acres of Clams"
filename[ OLDSETLR
has no chorus, no attribution, and no punctuation. You may want to substitute the version I posted here (click)

-Joe-

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Just a tiny correction in "Frozen Logger"
filename[ FROZLOGR

Second stanza:

"I see that you are a logger, and not just a common bum,
'Cause nobody but a logger stirs his coffee with his thumb.

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Please note the spelling of the name of Mudcatter/Songwriter Anne Lister. It's spelled "Ann" in two songs in the DT:

• Moth - filename[ MOTH
  
• Icarus - filename[ ICARUSFL

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Oklahoma Hills - filename[ OKLAHILL
Slight change in the first verse, second-last line, should be:

Many a lesson I have learned

There are a number of other parts one could quibble about, but this one doesn't make sense, just because of that missing article. Oh, and while you're at it, you may want to standardize the format on the chorus instead of just having "cho:"

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AZEKATARLE - filename[ AZEKTRLE seems to be a nonstandard spelling of the song title. A Google search for AZEKATARLE brings up only information that is derived from the Digital Tradition. I found four recordings, including one by Pete Seeger, that spell it Asikatali. The English group Blue Murder spell it Azicatal. I think I'd list "Asikatali" as the primary song title, and include the others in the notes to facilitate searching.

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Bluebeard - filename[ BLUBEARD

I added songwriter and source attribution and made several small corrections in this post.

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For the song BORDERLINES, filename[ BORDERLN :
The daughter of one of the songwriters posted corrected lyrics in this message (click)

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For the song titled "Finlandia" in the DT
filename[ FINLNDIA
There are a few spelling errors, so I posted a corrected version at the bottom of this message (click).

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Masato posted corrected lyrics to "Battle Hymn of the Republic" in this message (click)
The DT version has several mondegreens and other mistakes.

filename[ GLORYHAL

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06 Jul 11 - 01:25 PM (#3182526)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

Both Sides the Tweed
filename[ BTHTWEED
This message (click) contains corrected lyrics. The difference I see is in only one word, but it's important: third line of the chours should be

Let friendship and honour unite

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Very slight but important correction in Kimmage
filename[ KIMMAGE

The first line of the penultimate verse should be

I went down to the Tenancy Section

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09 Aug 11 - 09:14 AM (#3204545)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Jim Dixon

ROCKALL should properly be called ROCK ON, ROCKALL. It was written by Brian Warfield, a member of the Wolfe Tones, and first recorded by the Wolfe Tones.

This information is from Allmusic.com

filename[ ROCKALL

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10 Aug 11 - 02:05 AM (#3205105)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

I'm An Old Cowhand...
filename[ COWHAND
is missing a verse, and the DT lyrics are convoluted.
You'll find complete lyrics in this message.

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They Wounded Old Ireland was written by Andy M. Stewart (DT says Mark Westphal)
filename[ WOUNDIRE

See this thread for explanation.

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Corrections for The Banks of Marble [filename[ BNKMRBLE] are in this message. The DT has lots of little errors.

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20 Aug 11 - 01:51 PM (#3209993)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Jim Dixon

ASCAP.com says Buffy Sainte Marie wrote PINEY WOOD HILLS.
filename[ PINWDHIL

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22 Aug 11 - 11:13 PM (#3211223)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Jim Dixon

I'VE BEEN EVERYWHERE in the DT has lots of misspelled place names.

See the version posted here for corrections.

Also, it needs to have an attribution added:

Words and music by "Geoff Mack" (Real name: Albert Geoffrey McElhinney)
As sung by Hank Snow, 1962

I think it needs the "Hank Snow" information because another version with the same title and by the same songwriter, but using all Australian place names, was recorded in Australia in the same year by Lucky Starr.

filename[ IVBNEWHR

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14 Nov 11 - 09:59 AM (#3256772)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Jim Dixon

The song in the DT that is called THE SHAPE OF MY LOVE is actually BALLAD OF THE SHAPE OF THINGS written by Sheldon M. Harnick. That is the legal title according to BMI; SHAPE OF THINGS is given as an alternate title.

filename[ SHAPELOV

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17 Dec 11 - 09:06 PM (#3275723)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

There are a number of mistakes and an entirely incorrect verse (from another song) in "A Wee Docht and Doris" - filename[ DOCHDORS
I posted lyrics from the sheet music in this message

-Joe-

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A Place in the Choir, filename[ PLACHOIR, is by Bill Staines

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Two typos in HE KELTY CLIPPIE - filename filename[ KELTYCLP.txt

The title, of course, should be "The Kelty Clippie." There's a space in "it's" in the chorus that shouldn't be there.

In addition, the file name should probably be simply KELTYCLP and not KELTYCLP.txt

Otherwise, the DT text seems to be a perfect transcription of the lyrics in The Scottish Folksinger

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"No Man's Land" by Eric Bogle
filename[ NOMANLD
Looks like an exact transcription of the lyrics from ericbogle.net - just one typo in the second line - the word "gy" is obviously incorrect. I question "no Willie McBride" in the first line of the fourth verse, but that's also what they have on the Bogle Website.
BobKnight's transcription and the DT version are essentially the same, with a few minor differences. I will agree that Bob's transcription is generally closer to to the lyrics Bogle sings on the By Request CD.
Note that ericbogle.net claims to be the official Eric Bogle Website. It does seem authentic, but note that it is located in South Africa. Even "official Websites are often wrong.
Stone Cold Dead in the Market
filename[ COLDDEAD

One line has "I'm goming back" - the source was my posting of the lyrics in the Forum, and the typographical mistake was mine. Please cover up for my peccadillo and replace it with "I'm coming back."

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Fiddler's Green filename[ FIDGREEN - note that the spelling of the songwriter name is John Conolly. There are several minor errors in the transcription. See this message for a corrected transcription of the lyrics.

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23 Apr 12 - 02:21 AM (#3341989)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Genie

The DT has Mark Cohen's parody lyrics "(Perennial Beginner) The F-Chord" listed as being to the tune of: "A Conversation with Mother (Berryman and Berryman)."

The title of the Berrymans' song is "A Chat With Your Mother (The F-Word)."

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30 May 12 - 11:07 AM (#3357261)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: GUEST,Nick Woolf

Pity the Downtrodden Landlord

Filename [ LANDPITY

You may recall the search for the author of this song.

It was finally tracked down in Feb 07, when we found the original sheet music.

see http://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=30748#1979175

Here is the song in DT format :


PITY THE DOWNTRODDEN LANDLORD
(Lyric by Dr Barnet Woolf   Music by Arnold Clayton)

Please open your hearts and your purses
To a man who is misunderstood.
He gets all the kicks and the curses,
Though he wishes you nothing but good:
He wistfully begs you to show him
You think he's a friend, not a louse,
So remember the debt that you owe him,
The landlord who lends you his house.

CHORUS:
So pity the downtrodden landlord,
And his back that is burdened and bent;
Respect his grey hairs, don't ask for repairs,
And don't be behind with the rent !

You are able to work for your living
And rejoice in your strength and your skill;
So try to be kind and forgiving
To a man whom a day's work would kill;
You can work and still talk to your neighbour,
You can look the whole world in the face,
But the landlord who ventured to labour,
Would never survive the disgrace
CHORUS

When thunder clouds gather and darken,
You can sleep undisturbed in your bed,
But the landlord must sit up and hearken,
And shiver, and wonder, and dread.
If you're killed, then you'll die in a hurry,
And you never will know your bad luck,
But the landlord is shaking with worry,
"Has one of my houses been struck?"
CHORUS

When a landlord resorts to eviction,
Don't think that he does it for spite;
He is acting from deepest conviction,
And what's right, after all, is what's right;
But I see that your hearts are all hardened,
And I fear I'm appealing in vain;
Yet I hope that my last plea will be pardoned,
If I beg on my knees once again .
CHORUS

© Workers' Music Association No. 9029


http://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=30748#1979175

NW

What needs changing on DT is the attribution, and deleting the query on the attribution of the second verse.

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01 Jun 12 - 07:10 AM (#3357958)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: GUEST,Gerry

The song, Settle Down, is in the database twice, once under Settle Down (I'm Goin' Down That Highway), once under Maybe I'll Settle Down, and in both places it is attributed to Tom Paxton, but it was written by Mike Settle (according to the liner notes on a Peter Paul and Mary album, and a Judy Collins album).

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01 Jun 12 - 04:20 PM (#3358133)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Q (Frank Staplin)

"Settle Down" (Goin' Down the at Highway), by *"Mike Settle, Essex Music Inc., ASCAP."
Lyrics here- http://www.peterpaulandmary.com/music/02-01.htm

* Could not find listed at ASCAP.

The song is listed in Settle's bio. at http://www.lazyka.com/linernotes/persone/Settle.htm

First release on album "Folk Sing Hallelujah", Mike Settle and the Settlers, 1961
http://www.secondhandsongs.com/work/122558

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05 Jun 12 - 10:04 PM (#3359807)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

"Housewife's Lament" - filename[ HSEWFLAM


We determined in thread 129897 that the original poem was written by Eliza Sproat Turner (1826-1903), published in Arthur's Lady's Home Magazine, Volume 37 (Philadelphia: T. S. Arthur & Sons, April, 1871), page 241. The original title of the poem was "The Housekeeper's Tragedy."

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There are a few corrections for the lyrics of Cyril Tawney's "Five Foot Flirt" in this message (click).
filename[ FLIRT5FT

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In America the Beautiful, filename[ AMBEAUT1
the songwriter is twice referred to as Kathering Lee Bates.

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Alan Bell's Windmills (plural) is incorrectly identified as a singular "Windmill," filename filename[ WNDMILL. The DT transcription has several minor errors and mondegreens. A fully corrected text can be found in this message

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A couple of typos in the text of "The Death of Emma Hartsell," filename[ HARTSELL:

• last line of third verse: Her throat was cut frorn ear to ear. - "from"
• last line of fourth verse: Tl@e howling mob could scarcely pass - first word is "The."
  
• first line of tenth verse: As they stood on death'ss cold brink - "death's

-Joe-

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20 May 13 - 09:37 AM (#3517106)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: thnidu

0.7742 - WE SHALL NOT BE MOVED
http://www.mudcat.org/@displaysong.cfm?SongID=7647

attributes authorship of the spiritual to V. O. Fossett. But as the first poster in thread http://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=76413,
"GUEST,[e-mail]", points out,

"Since he wrote in the 1950's-70's and this tune predates the union change to "We" in the 1930's could he be the arranger?"

-- Mark Mandel

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28 May 13 - 04:55 AM (#3519941)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

"The Fiddler," filename FIDDLER, is unattributed in the DT. We've determined the songwriter is Charlie Moore. There are numerous errors in the lyrics in the DT, so there's a corrected transcription in this message (click).

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Larry Kaplan sent corrected lyrics for his "Get Her Into Shore" filename[ SHORINTO
Corrected lyrics here (click)

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The Cloakmakers' Union, filename[ CLOAKMKR, has its title spelled wrong.

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There's a line missing and a couple of wrong words in "The King of Ballyhooley", filename[ BLLYHOOL
You'll find corrected lyrics in this message.

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"This Ol' Riverboat" appears in the Digital Tradition twice, each time with only half the lyrics. The song was written by Randy Sparks. filename[ STMBOAT. Complete lyrics are in this post (click).

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24 Sep 13 - 02:15 PM (#3560910)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Stevebury

I'm working up the song "Schooner E. A. Horton," based principally on the version in Flanders and Olney, Ballads Migrant in New England. So I've noted a couple of corrections to the version in the Digital Tradition.

* The song is incorrectly attributed as "Collected from Charles Cooke of Ripton VT in 1941." That description, which appears after the song, actually refers to the succeeding song in the book. The correct attribution should be "collected from Mr. Albert Howard in Orford NH (formerly of Blue Hill ME), 1942" .

* midi, melody line 6 (of 8): the last note should be c-natural not c-sharp

[Note: You've correctly transcribed the low B in lines 2, 4, 5 and 8; but I am convinced that they are incorrect as published in "Ballads Migrant ...". A C instead of B would be consistent with the tune in Warner for 'Heenan and Sayers'. There are other acknowleged errors in the music transcriptions in "Ballads Migrant ...".]

* verse 1, line 6: "stolen" should be "stole"

* verse 6, line 2 "treatie" should be "treaty"

[Note: I would add '[sic]' after "sixty-one" at the end of verse 2, line 1; the correct date is 1871.   I would also add '[sic]' after the first "Yankee" in verse 3 line 4; this clearly should be "Britishers", and so appears in "Minstrelsy of Maine.]

Stevebury

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24 Oct 13 - 07:38 PM (#3569763)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

Bob Coltman gave me a couple corrections for his "Lonesome Robin," filename[ LONEROBN
Full discussion is in this message

(here is a corrected Digital Tradition version)

LONESOME ROBIN
(Bob Coltman)

Rise up on your bed of straw,
And see if you can't bend back your bow one last time;
You're sick with your wounds and you think you don't care,
But you know it'll prey on your mind.
And wherever your arrow falls to the ground,
We'll lay lonesome Robin down, one last time.
    No more Robin, no more, your outlaw days are over.

Funny how hot is the sun,
Now that you can't run away to the shade;
And you can't help thinkin' of the deer you have run,
And of all the games you have played;
And wonderin' what Marian found to do,
That's better than comin' to see you, one last time.
    No more Robin, no more, your outlaw days are over.

When you were a little boy,
You had to go to bed early while the sun still shone;
'Twas just like sleep was the end of the world,
And tomorrow would never come.
Now lonesome Robin can't you just close your eyes,
And pretend that the sun will still rise one last time.
    No more Robin, no more, your outlaw days are over.

Now time has took your time away,
Time and contraptions have whittled you down;
And all the times that you ever have had
Have took to their heels and gone.
Hold on to whatever is closest to you,
It's all lonesome Robin can do, one last time.
    No more Robin, no more, your outlaw days are over.



note: death of Robin Hood
@death @outlaw
Recorded by Bob Coltman
Copyright Bob Coltman
filename[ LONEROBN
SOF

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24 Oct 13 - 07:52 PM (#3569768)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

Bob Coltman says that Kissing Song - filename[ KISSNG
is improperly credited to song collector Jean Thomas. The songwriter is Billy Carter, 1882. Perhaps this note could be added at the bottom of the lyrics:

This song was frequently sung by "Blind Bill" Day, who was discovered by song collector Jean Thomas. Bob Coltman recently discovered that the song can be credited properly as a vaudeville or stage song, words and music by Billy Carter, 1882.

Full discussion in this message (click)

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25 Oct 13 - 02:30 PM (#3570047)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Q (Frank Staplin)

Billy Carter (b. 1834) was a banjoist and blackface performer in minstrel and vaudeville shows. I can find nothing on his songs or routines. His scrapbook is held by Middle Tennessee University.

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17 Jan 14 - 04:02 PM (#3593064)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

I posted corrections to typographical errors in "Didn't I Dance" in this message. Filename [ DDNTDANC

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20 Jan 14 - 02:01 PM (#3593909)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Q (Frank Staplin)

"Save Your Money While You're Young;" DT version should be credited to Jim Doherty; In Fowke, 1970, "Lumbering Songs from the Northern Woods," pp. 206-207. with musical score.

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I question this, Q. It's clear that a printed version came from the singing of Jim Doherty, but not that Doherty was the songwriter. When posting information, be careful to distinguish whether you're attributing to a source or to a songwriter.
Thanks.
-Joe Offer-

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22 Jan 14 - 12:11 PM (#3594691)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Q (Frank Staplin)

"THE SPINNING WHEEL," DT, with the chorus "Merrily, cheerily, noiselessly whirring" - lyrics by John Francis Waller (1809-1894), using the pseudonym Jonathan Freke Slingsby.

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Please see original lyrics posted by Jim Dixon in this thread (click).
-Joe-

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11 Mar 14 - 03:12 AM (#3608857)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

Johnson's Motor Gar bus be a misspelled song title, dontchathink?
filename[ JHNMTR

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25 Apr 14 - 12:30 AM (#3622133)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

"Dooley," recorded by the Dillards, is unattributed, has mondegreens, and appears twice in the Digital Tradition:
filename[ DOOLEY
filename[ OLDOOLWY

This thread has the whole story, but there are corrected lyrics from Stewie:

DOOLEY
(Rodney Dillard/Mitch Jayne)

Now Dooley was a good old man, he lived below the mill
Dooley had two daughters and a forty-gallon still
One girl watched the boiler, the other watched the spout
Mama corked the bottles when ol' Dooley fetched them out

CHORUS
Dooley, slippin' up the holler
Dooley, tryin' to make a dollar
Dooley, gimme a swaller
And I'll pay you back some day

Now Dooley was a trader when into town he'd come
Sugar by the bushel and molasses by the drum
The revenuers came for him, slippin' through the woods
Dooley kept behind them all and never lost his goods

CHORUS

Now I remember very well the day old Dooley died
The women folk looked sorry and the men stood around and cried
Now Dooley's on the mountain, he lies there all alone
They put a jug beside him and a barrel for a stone

CHORUS [last line repeated]

The lyrics above are from the original Dillards recording of the song. Later recordings switched the couplets in the second verse:

The revenuers came for him, slippin' through the woods
Dooley kept behind them all and never lost his goods
Now Dooley was a trader when into town he'd come
Sugar by the bushel and molasses by the drum
(as performed by the Dillards on the Andy Griffith Show)

@drink @outlaw
filename[ DOOLEY
BJS

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17 Jun 14 - 12:32 PM (#3633958)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Desert Dancer

Per this thread, Marching song/Cadence Count (see especially recent posts), SOUND OFF (CADENCE COUNT) (DUCKWORTH CHANT) attribution is incorrect.

It says,

In WWII, black troops were, apparently, given more freedom
of self-expression than were white troops. Fancy drill
teams, particularly from Fort Duckworth, Alabama, toured and
popularized jazzier cadence counts. There was a pop record
in the early 50s that wound up on the hit parade. RG

See this page at the Missouri Folklore Society:

The modern cadence call was born in the spring of 1944 at Fort Slocum, New York's Provisional Training Center. Colonel Bernard Lentz, the fort's commander at the time, published a well-established account of the event:

…as a company … was returning from a long tedious march through swamps and rough country, a chant broke the stillness of the night. Upon investigation, it was found that a Negro soldier by the name of Willie Duckworth, on detached service with the Provisional Training Center, was chanting to build up the spirits of his comrades.

            It was not long before the infectious rhythm was spreading throughout the ranks. Footweary soldiers started to pick up their step in cadence with the growing chorus of hearty male voices. Instead of a down trodden, fatigued company, here marched 200 soldiers with heads up, a spring to their step, and smiles on their faces. This transformation occurred with the beginning of the Duckworth Chant.

            Upon returning to Fort Slocum, Pvt. Duckworth, with the aid of Provisional Training Center instructors, composed a series of verses and choruses to be used with the marching cadence. After that eventful evening the Duckworth Chant was made a part of the drill at Fort Slocum as it proved to be not only a tremendous morale factor while marching, but also coordinated the movements of close order drill with troop precision. (Lentz 70).

This account is included in its entirety because Bernard Lentz is the man who standardized the use of cadence calls in the military. It is an account of the birth of the modern cadence call, written by the man who would ensure its proliferation, and therefore very special to connoisseurs of this particular military folklore. It's the beginning of a very lively and diverse oral art form, different from marching songs and drill for many reasons. The original Duckworth Chant, as presented in Lentz's book, is included in the appendix.

            Lentz didn't stop at making cadence calls standard at Ft. Slocum. He was loud enough about the new tool that "the Duckworth Chant was ordered to be recorded and distributed to the Armed Forces" by the "War Department (now the Department of Defense)" (Johnson 1: 21). Lentz guaranteed the continuation of cadence calls throughout the military for years to come by recognizing the value of this motivational tool.

The chant is copyright Lentz & Duckworth.

~ Becky in Long Beach

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17 Jun 14 - 12:48 PM (#3633963)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Tattie Bogle

I know I've asked before, but can we please get the correct version of Caledonia by Dougie Maclean? (In the DT as Caledonia 2) I saw him live on Saturday night, and this is what he sang (taken straight from his own website, so must be right - will someone please believe me now - NO coattails!!)

http://www.dougiemaclean.com/index.php/c/29-caledonia

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14 Jul 14 - 02:39 PM (#3642116)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: MGM·Lion

Why does the DT call the song which identifies itself in the first line as about a sailor, "The Rambling Soldier"? ~~

RAMBLING SOLDIER/TRIM-RIGGED DOXY
I am a sailor brisk and bold...

Shome mishtake shurely?

~M~

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16 Jul 14 - 07:15 AM (#3642544)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: MGM·Lion

"The Garden Where The Praties Go" should be attributed to Johnny Patterson -- check him on Wikipedia.

~M~

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10 Aug 14 - 01:57 PM (#3649894)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: MGM·Lion

Calico Printer's Clerk [sic]. Attribution to Mike Raven of The Halliard should read "Dave Moran of The Halliard". (Although he had solo tracks on same disc, John Raven was not a member of The Halliard, who were Dave Moran, Nigel Paterson and Nic Jones.)

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11 Aug 14 - 09:35 AM (#3650069)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Steve Gardham

Calico Printer's Clerk
While we're on we might as well put in the correct attribution which is already on several threads particularly those on Harry Clifton. He wrote the words and sang it c1863. The Glasgow Poet's Box printed it in 1865. The music is ascribed to Charles Coote Jr. It was published by Hopwood & Crew, serial H&C 732.

I wouldn't describe it as either Music Hall or broadside ballad. It's a concert or drawing room piece. Clifton strictly speaking wasn't Music Hall although he was just as big as the swells and Lion Comiques. He plied his trade around the country in the more upmarket theatres usually arranged by himself.

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11 Aug 14 - 09:52 AM (#3650075)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: MGM·Lion

To what tune did he sing it, Steve? SFAIK, the tune on that Halliard/John Raven record is Dave Moran's own, like most of the songs The Halliard sang their broadsides to; one exception being "Going For A Soldier, Jenny", composed & sung by Nic Jones (or, as credited on that one early disc, Nick Jones!).

≈M≈

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11 Aug 14 - 10:12 AM (#3650078)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: MGM·Lion

Out of interest, how often is this thread checked, & necessary corrections carried out in DT? It is now about a month since I posted the name of the writer of Garden Where The Praties Grow, but no emendation appears to have been made on DT.

≈M≈

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11 Aug 14 - 10:14 AM (#3650080)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: MGM·Lion

...nor to Rambling Soldier, which is actually about a sailor.

Should not those ic DT check this thread from time to time?

~M~

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11 Aug 14 - 12:19 PM (#3650111)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Q (Frank Staplin)

Joe is on vacation, I believe; he handles this thread.

He asked me to post corrections of this kind in the thread on the song.
See thread "Rambling Soldier," thread 108324, where a text for "Rambling Soldier" is posted.

DT corrections of the sort you ask for probably won't appear in your lifetime.

Rambling Soldier

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11 Aug 14 - 12:41 PM (#3650121)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: MGM·Lion

I should have thought DT should be definitive, insofar as such a thing is possible; and that this thread exists to ensure this to be the case.

Oh, well...

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11 Aug 14 - 01:07 PM (#3650133)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Q (Frank Staplin)

MGM Lion, do you want to volunteer to do it?

A thankless job that takes large chunks of time (corrections must be checked for accuracy, etc.).
I wouldn't want to do it, and I don't think you will do it, either.

Many of the songs in the DT were taken from threads and are versions from various singers selected by the poster.

I don't believe that "definiteness" was considered; that would require researching each one.

I raised the question a while back, but I have since realized the magnitude of the problem.
I don't like some of the DT entries either.
Just make sure that your version of the one true lyric is in a thread.

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11 Aug 14 - 01:35 PM (#3650141)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: MGM·Lion

I might if I were a bit younger, Q. But your remark about it not happening 'in my lifetime' was not so much of a hyperbole, as I am now 82; so I just don't have that much energy any more. Still; I take your point.   

Even so: seriously; if an attribution is posted here that is missing from the DT entry, or a single error drawn to attention, would it be so onerous to emend that one page? I ask, genuinely, for information; without checking every single DT entry from cold, surely a page can be opened and emended as a fairly brief task. How long can it take to do one? Can't be that difficult of access, surely?

≈M≈

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11 Aug 14 - 02:53 PM (#3650162)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Q (Frank Staplin)

Talk to Joe when he gets back.

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11 Aug 14 - 04:41 PM (#3650188)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Steve Gardham

The Clifton tune is nothing like the Folk Scene tune. Is the midi not available on the Harry Clifton thread? I thought Artful did all the midis.

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11 Aug 14 - 06:33 PM (#3650213)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: GUEST,Joe, at the Women's Center

I'm here every day, but a little bit less because I've been part of the jury on a three-week trial.

I'll clean this thread up sometime this week, so the information will be ready for Susan of DT to harvest for the next edition of the Digital Tradition (we haven't had a new edition for a couple years or more).

This thread is NOT for discussion - it is for brief, factual submissions of changes to the Digital Tradition. Discussion and all that other stuff should be in the thread on the song. When stuff is posted here, it should contain only the changes, plus a link back to the discussion thread for documentation.

Don't post something here if you can't document it.

-Joe-

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30 Sep 14 - 02:08 PM (#3664776)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: OldPossum

Death Come Easy, filename[ DEATHEZ, was written by Harvey Andrews.

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30 Sep 14 - 03:38 PM (#3664788)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Q (Frank Staplin)

Death Comes Easy- See "Index of Harvey Andrews' Songs" which will verify that he is the composer.

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16 Oct 14 - 01:53 AM (#3669526)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

Three Ravens - filename[ THRERAVN
"Their lies a knight slain under his shield," in the second verse, really makes me cringe.

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Hey, Good Lookin' appears twice in the database:

• Filename[ GOODLOKN
• Filename[ HEYGDLKN

Both are good transcriptions, but I think [ HEYGDLKN is slightly better. at (*tooken), I'd add [took in??]

Note in this thread, there are similar lyrics to a Cole Porter song of the same title. Different melody, though.

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LADY ALL SKIN AND BONES - filename[ SKINBONE - appears twice in the online database, but with the same filename. The lyrics seem identical, but one entry has a tune file connected to it.
http://mudcat.org/@displaysong.cfm?SongID=8819
http://mudcat.org/@displaysong.cfm?SongID=10191

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Night Rider's Lament, filename[ WHYRIDE - lyrics we have are truncated and make no sense. Correct lyrics are in this message.

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San Antonio Rose, filename[ SANANTON - our text twice mentions a "moonlit pass" - that's a "moonlit path" - the Alamo is on flatland, no passes nearby - verified with Bob Wills recording.

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Lani Herrmannn says her Pickle Carol filename[ PICKCARL - is actually titled "The Pickle Tree Carol," and she thanks you for getting the lyrics mostly right.

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The Red Flag filename[ REDFLAG - songwriter is Jim Connell

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28 Feb 15 - 03:04 AM (#3690375)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

Our lyrics for Cindy Kallet's "Wings to Fly" are way off. See correction here: /detail.cfm?messages__Message_ID=3690373
filename[ WINGSFLY

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Several corrections to the lyrics of The Jeannie C. (Stan Rogers) here (click).
filename[ JEANNIEC

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OFF TO THE SUGARBUSH AGAIN (Bill Cameron & Gary Glover)
appears twice:

filename[ SUGRBUSH - http://www.mudcat.org/@displaysong.cfm?SongID=10223

filename[ SUGRBUSH - http://www.mudcat.org/@displaysong.cfm?SongID=8577

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11 Jun 15 - 12:08 PM (#3716045)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: MGM·Lion

Please see my post on the 'Funny Songs With Colours In Titles' thread, re errors in DT notes on The Brown & Yellow Ale -- mistakenly given under title, from an error of hearing by an American singer once, as Brown & Yellow Earl [sic].

This error should be emended.

≈M≈

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I think you are correct, Mike. We have two songs:

• The Brown and the Yellow Ale
• The Brown and Yellow Earl - which is the version by my neighbor and former boss, former topless folksinger Debby McClatchy. Apparently, she has acknowledged the error in recent years. We probably should add explanation or drop Debby's version.

See this thread

-Joe Offer-

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17 Dec 15 - 03:03 PM (#3759105)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

Coventry Carol, filename[ COVCAROL - first line of the fourth verse is Then woe is me, poor child for thee

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18 Dec 15 - 01:38 AM (#3759207)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: MGM·Lion

Re Joe's note on my 11 jun 15 post, 2 above:-

Had never heard before that Debby McClatchy had introduced a topless element into folk performances.

Goody for her!

≈M≈

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Yup. Her mom used to make her costumes, such as they were...
-Joe-

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23 Jan 17 - 02:35 AM (#3834221)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

"My Dame Had a Lame Tame Crane" appears twice:

Lame Tame Crane - filename[ LAMETAME

My Dame Had a Lame Tame Crane (round) - filename[ LAMECRN

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23 Jan 17 - 06:09 AM (#3834246)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Susan of DT

We have had no way to make corrections for a while, so I hav enot been watching this thread. Max is working on it.

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04 Jul 17 - 02:22 AM (#3864161)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

"No More, My Lord" appears in three near-identical iterations in the Digital Tradition:

• filename[ NOMYLORD
• filename[ MOMORLRD
• filename[ NOMOLORD

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02 Nov 17 - 05:18 PM (#3886456)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

Note "The Buckskin Bag of Gold" [filename[ BUCKBAG] corrections are in this message: https://mudcat.org/detail.cfm?messages__Message_ID=3886453. There's a rest missing in the melody at the end of each verse, and there are three words to be corrected.

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08 Jun 18 - 01:18 AM (#3929749)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

Please note that the songwriter name for Dancing at Whitsun is mixed up. The songwriter is Austin John Marshall. Filename [ DNCWHIT

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19 Jul 20 - 07:06 AM (#4064886)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: GUEST,Gerry

Some small corrections to Do You Think That I Do Not Know

1st stanza, line 7 "haunting" should be "halting"

2nd stanza, line 6 "dancer" should be "dancers" (and there shouldn't be an apostrophe after "row")

3rd stanza, line 3 "quavering" should be "quivering"

5th stanza, line 2 "scene was" should be "scenes were"; line 6 "She'll" should be "Shall"

My source is Poetical Works of Henry Lawson. There are a couple of other differences that are too small to mention.

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08 May 22 - 10:52 PM (#4141277)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Felipa

GRACE the lyrics are in the Digital Tradition
https://mudcat.org/@displaysong.cfm?SongID=2379 but the DT is lacking attribution to authors Frank and Seán Ó Meara

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09 May 22 - 02:37 PM (#4141291)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Susan of DT

It has not been possible to correct the DT for many, many years.

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09 May 22 - 02:45 PM (#4141293)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Felipa

Susan, I was thinking this discussion thread could be used as a repository of attribution and minor corrections; even though the DT is not changed, people could check here for information.

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14 May 22 - 05:41 PM (#4141657)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Felipa

The Orange and the Green https://mudcat.org/@displaysong.cfm?SongID=4523 is lacking attribution to Anthony Murphy for the words.

I think the transcription given by Joe Offer in the discussion thread https://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=80905 is better than that given in the DT/
Surely "Oh, my father was an Ulster man" (or even My father was an Englishman") for the first words fit the rest of the verse better than "Once there was an Irishman". As Tony Murphy was a Merseyside resident, perhaps he did write "My mother was a Catholic, from Kelsey town came she" I don't know; I would suggest "from Keady town came she", and Joe Offer wrote "from County Cork came she," as he heard that in recordings. A mother from Keady (in N Ireland) goes well with with the father and Englishman, while Cork goes better as a contrast with the father an Ulsterman. Does anyone know what Tony Murphy actually wrote, or if he perhaps had more than one version? In any case, he does deserve credit as author of the lyrics.

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14 May 22 - 08:26 PM (#4141674)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Tattie Bogle

The lyrics I posted to The Orange and the Green in a more recent thread came from another website, but also have the Ulsterman, and Co Cork, which would be much more recognisable than Keady or Kelsey. The lyrics I use match Joe’s, and are also as sung by Paddy Reilly. There are a number of other lyrics websites that also use Ulsterman and County Cork.

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14 May 22 - 11:09 PM (#4141680)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

The most recent full update of the Digital Tradition was 2002, and we have not been able to develop a system for updating the DT that was agreeable to all parties involved. I have been developing "origins" and DTStudy threads on new songs and all songs in the DT that require research, discussion, or correction. If you have corrections, they are best posted in the "origins" threads.

• Origins index (for trad songs): https://mudcat.org/songorigins.cfm
  
• Musicians index (by songwriter name): https://mudcat.org/songorigins.cfm

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19 May 22 - 07:18 PM (#4142114)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: GUEST,Susanne (skw)

I wish the DT could be transferred to a Wiki. It would make adding to and correcting so much easier, though I see the difficulties.

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19 May 22 - 11:40 PM (#4142129)
Subject: RE: DT Attribution & Minor Corrections PermaThread
From: Joe Offer

Hi, Susanne - how would a Wiki be superior to our Forum threads? We are updating and correcting the Digital Tradition in our Origins threads. Where would we get the software for a Wiki, and how would it be better?

-Joe-

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