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04 Sep 98 - 06:46 AM (#37023) Subject: What is clawhammer style From: murray@mpce.mq.edu.au I have been reading some literature about old-time music and they refer to the banjo accompanyment as being "claw hammer style". Can anyone describe that. By the way, in reading this stuff I am getting interested in the banjo (passively for the time being, I hope). Here are some questions for banjo experts Do the five-string ones come in different sizes, and if so do the sizes correspond to different tunings, or just to acoustic differences like the difference between a dreadnaught and a parlor guitar. What other kinds of banjos are there besides five string? Actually I recently saw a film of somebody playing a fretless banjo. Thanks, Murray |
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04 Sep 98 - 07:00 AM (#37024) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Bill in Alabama Murray-- Clawhammer, sometimes called Frailing or Rapping the banjo, is the traditional style that was predominant, at least in most of the Appalachian U.S. south, prior to WWII. You can hear/see examples of the style on albums/videos of Grandpa Jones, of of most old-time Appalachian string bands. Banjo makers at one time did make the 5-strings in different sizes, but I suppose current ones are mostly of a uniform construction. A friend of mine has an old "piccolo banjo," which is favored by backpackers in my part of the country, and which must be tuned in C. Clawhammer banjoists quite frequently re-tune the banjo to play in different keys. Because many banjos were originally home-made, many of them were without frets, and there are still a few luthiers selling them at folk festivals and such places. The fretless ones are fine for solo work, but they don't make you particular with other musicians when you work with a group. More later. Bill |
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04 Sep 98 - 07:23 AM (#37029) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Dave T The actual technique of clawhammer is quite different than the more often heard "Scruggs" style. Instead if using the fingers to pick upwards from treble to bass as when finger picking guitar, you use the back of your fingernails to strike downard at the strings. Your thumb works the same way as normal. I think there's a book by Ken Perlman on clawhammer if you're interested (I believe it's put out by Mel Bay). Usually "frailers" use banjos with an open back and quite often they have wooden rims rather than brass. The only real variant in 5-string banjos is a Seeger style which has a longer neck. Pete Seeger started this and normally played with a capo for regular songs. He remove the capo to get access to lower bass notes. There a four-string banjos (tenors). I don't play banjo but a good friend does. Q: What's the difference between a banjo & a trampoline? A: You don't wear shoes when jump on a trampoline. Anyway I hope this helps. Any banjo players out there that can expand on this??? Dave |
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04 Sep 98 - 07:33 AM (#37032) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Barbara Shaw My husband plays old-timey clawhammer style as well as Scruggs 3-finger rolls and the occasional melodic licks down the neck. As a result of this exposure, I am founder and president of the Banjo Wife Support Group, so if you do take up the instrument and have a mate at risk, get her in touch with us. An emergency Mudcat thread will alert the rescue team.
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04 Sep 98 - 07:50 AM (#37035) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Barbara Shaw By the way, that phrase "down the neck" is pronounced "UP the neck" by most experienced banjo players. When the left arm, which is up in the air, is repositioned so that the fingers can move down closer to the banjo head, this downward motion is called UP. There are other intricacies, but take it slowly. |
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04 Sep 98 - 10:35 AM (#37058) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Jon W. I began by taking a community education class where the teacher taught Scruggs style picking and bluegrass songs. I gave up hope of ever having enough practice time to get fast enough on the right hand "rolls" to accomplish anything (plus I don't like wearing fingerpicks) so I started to explore claw hammer techniques. I bought the Ken Perlman book mentioned above, published by Mel Bay and now named "Basic Clawhammer Banjo." It's an excellent book for anyone interested in playing Irish/American fiddle tunes on banjo. It is, however, lacking in the explanation of technique. I've been able to learn a few of the tunes well enough to play up to speed, but my technique is backward. I still use my finger to pick up on the strings, only brushing down with a finger nail if I am playing more than one string. But what the hey--I'm only doing this for the fun of it anyway. The book comes with a CD of all the songs played clearly and slowly, and cost me about $18 US. Murray, stop being so passive. Jump in with both feet. Jump with your shoes on if you get frustrated. Jon W. |
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04 Sep 98 - 02:54 PM (#37088) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Banjomad Dear Barbera Shaw - can you please enrol my wife in your support group. I stooped to the ultimate degredation in trying to get her to understand my first love (the banjo) by buying her one of her own. Now I have become a Banjo Husband with little or no social life as she is out with every local banjo group you can think of. |
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04 Sep 98 - 03:50 PM (#37092) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Barbara Shaw It sounds like you two were meant for each other and are saving two other spouses. Social life is not necessary nor desirable when you play the banjo. Those faces speaking to you when you are staring glassy-eyed off into space as you tune the tuners are just a nuisance. |
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04 Sep 98 - 04:35 PM (#37095) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Art Thieme I had a banjo once that frustrated me so much I destroyed it with a clawhammer---ie. the name!! By the way, in the olden times, when banjos were strung with possum guts, one possum was only good for 4 and a half strings. That's why the 5th string stops part way up the neck! Art |
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05 Sep 98 - 04:20 AM (#37144) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: murray@mpce.mq.edu.au Thanks for the answers. Since the posting, I found a book for sale at our local library for about $US.60 called "Beginning the Five-String Banjo" by Jerry Silverman. He describes the technique very clearly and has a lot of traditional songs in it. Nonetheless, he never uses the term "claw hammer", so I am glad for the descriptions. Now that I have a book Jon, all I need is a banjo! I will start with soft-soled shoes. Banjomad, It is you who should join the support group! Murray |
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06 Sep 98 - 08:57 PM (#37266) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: John in Brisbane In 1974 I bought a Seeger type long necked Epiphone 5 string made In Kalamazoo. It had been sitting in the warehouse for (maybe) 10 years and did not have a case. Because it was the nicest thing I had ever owned I arranged for a case to be made for it. What eventually arrived was a case that housed it beautifully, but was unfortunately guitar shaped. The gigs I was doing at the time enabled me to stuff large quantities of free beer and cheese (kilos of the stuff) into the spare space in the case at the end of an evening. Perhaps I should have included this in the recent thread of tips for musicians. Buy a guitar case for your banjo. Regards John |
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07 Sep 98 - 12:51 AM (#37273) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Dale Rose No, that is not the way it goes. Fiddlers in the know buy banjo cases for their fiddles. That way they know that no one will bother stealing them! About the clawhammer terminology~~around here you are just as likely to hear it as frailing, rapping, drop thumbing, old time, or best of all, the right way! Like Dave T says above, most frailers use open back banjos, but the use is not universal. Notable exceptions are Uncle Dave Macon, of course, and Missourian Cathy Barton. On the other hand, I have really only noticed one person playing three finger style on an open back banjo, and that was someone who usually frails. Another point that no one has addressed yet, and I really am not well enough versed on this, but I will start it. Many frailers use a combination of metal and nylon strings, rather than all metal. Also frailers who play constantly use some sort of hardener on their finger nails, or even false nails because of the wear and tear on their nails. OK, I will let someone who really knows what they are talking about take it from there. |
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07 Sep 98 - 03:57 AM (#37293) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: takeo frailers use a nail side of finger to down pick the string, it sounds like cartar family picking on guitar. did maybell invent this style from frailing banjo? -takeo |
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07 Sep 98 - 09:18 AM (#37301) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Dave T I was at the Blue Skies Folk Festival this summer and Ken Perlman ran a clawhammer workshop; too bad I'm not a banjo player. Some players use layers of kleenex and crazy glue to build up their nails. This is also used by some fingerstyle guitarists. Bruce Cockburn's advice on this is "...don't try it after drinking too much...". Sounds sensible to me. Dave |
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07 Sep 98 - 07:30 PM (#37354) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: murray@mpce.mq.edu.au Let me get some details straight. By bargain-basement banjo book describes what it calls the "basic banjo strum" which sounds like claw-hammer style. As I understand it, in this style the nails are used to brush the strings rather than actually pluck them. Is that right? Dale's point interests me. What kind of strings are traditionally used with the open-backed banjo and the claw-hammer style? Does tradition dictate using picks, or the nails? Murray |
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07 Sep 98 - 07:59 PM (#37355) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: BSeed Perlman's book Basic Clawhammer Banjo is anything but a basic clawhammer book--it contains tablature for a few dozen fiddle tunes, few of them part of the repertoire of most bluegrass players. The latest edition of that book comes with a CD of one time through each of the tunes (just AB, not the traditional AABB) with no accompaniment. To give an idea of how far from basic the book is, the first song includes triplets. Perlman does have another book, Clawhammer Style Banjo which is a basic text. There are both audio and video tapes available for the lessons in this book. Pedagogically speaking, the video tape is extremely useful, showing clear closeups of both hands (esthetically speaking, the tape is one of the ugliest I have seen). The song selection in this book is much more useful than in the other book. When you play up the neck, although you go physically lower, you go higher in tone. That's why it's called "up the neck." Some clawhammer players use finger picks--backwards, of course--and a thumb pick, both to protect the nails and to get greater volume and crisper tone. I've never been quite comfortable with them, but i've also never been very comfortable using picks for three finger picking. For a while, I was going every week or two to a manicurist to have the nails on my index and middle fingers built up because my nails are not very thick, but I stopped it because the manicurist was filing my nails almost down to the skin before applying the polyester or whatever it was. I stopped doing that because I stopped whamming on the strings and head as I learned drop-thumb (double thumbing). I sometimes put scotch tape on my nails before a long session. It works for a while, and can be easily replaced. |
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08 Sep 98 - 06:25 AM (#37395) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Bill in Alabama Murray-- Clawhammer banjo is as you describe it--using the nails (actually a particular nail, usually a bit longer than the others) to brush the strings--usually two down strokes and then a pick-up with the thumb on the fifth string. No picks are required. Clawhammer style is not limited to open-back instruments. In my part of the country, folks played whatever was available through the Monkey-Ward or the Sears catalogs or from local sources, and it was availability rather than style which ruled one's decision. Many of the old-timers I knew growing up provided their own resonators in open-back banjos by inserting a pie-pan in the pot. Old-time fiddle players, especially the older ones, seem to prefer a clawhammer banjo as a back-up instrument, as the style accentuates the down-beat, and provides a percussive sound not unlike a brushed drum. I learned the style from a fine gentleman known as Uncle Arthur Kuykendall, who used a "drop-thumb" style in which he used his thumb on all strings rather than just the fifth.
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08 Sep 98 - 09:42 PM (#37512) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: BSeed I first learned to play from Pete Seeger's book and got stuck for years up-picking: the basic strum is one: pick up on one of the top three strings and: two: strum down across four strings with the nails and: pluck the fifth string with your thumb the rhythm is boom tid-dy, boom tid-dy. after that you add at one and a hammer on, pull off, or slide: one: pick up and: hammer (or pull off or slide) two: brush down and: thumb on 5th string I got as far as doublethumbing: on the one and, instead of a rest or pause, the thumb would pick a note on the second, third, or fourth string; on two, instead of brushing down, you pick a string with your index finger and follow with another thumb on 5th string. I got pretty good at doublethumbing melodies, but I was still pretty much stuck with that plus guitar style picking and a rhumba rhythm I also learned from seeger and used for calypso music. I was playing almost exclusively solo at the time, primarily to back up my singing.
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08 Sep 98 - 11:28 PM (#37534) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Art Thieme I'd love to get Cathy Fink and Cathy Barton to do a BANJO DUET CD. Two wonderful frailers---no end to what they both can do---ALL styles actually. Art
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09 Sep 98 - 12:05 AM (#37543) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: BSeed That was supposed to be 1 - 2 - - 3 - - 4 - - 5 - - 6 - - 7 - - 8 - --seed I hope this comes out right this time. |
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09 Sep 98 - 12:11 AM (#37544) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: BSeed Nope. Not quite right. Lemme try again: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 6 - 7 - 8 - --seed |
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09 Sep 98 - 05:53 AM (#37569) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: murray@mpce.mq.edu.au Bseed, Your description of Seeger's basic up picking style agrees with what Silverman calles the "old time style". If you replace the up-pick by a downward brush with the back of the nail, then he calles it "frailing" It sound like what he calls frailing is pretty much claw-hammer style, except that you use all four nails instead of one nail on the second down-stroke Murray |
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09 Sep 98 - 07:02 AM (#37570) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Bill in Alabama Art-- My memory isn't what it used to be, but I believe that you worked with me on the Clawhammer Banjo Workshop in Winfield, Kansas, many years ago. Or maybe it wasn't Winfield--or maybe it wasn't clawhammer banjo-- but I'm convinced that we worked some sort of panel together at some major festival--perhaps in the mid-eighties.?????? Bill Foster (Foster Family String Band) |
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09 Sep 98 - 08:50 PM (#37684) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: BSeed Murray, clawhammer and frailing are used interchangeably, with the basic stroke being sometimes referred to as frailing and the drop-thumb stroke more often described as clawhammer (at least that's my impression from reading a bunch of banjo books). BTW, did you read the rest of my post, or was it just too long and boring? --seed |
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10 Sep 98 - 03:39 AM (#37741) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: BSeed By the way (this is something I realized as I was reading over my treatise a few postings above), frailing produces a more driving rhythm than does up-picking because in up-picking, the energy behind the picking motion is produced largely by the muscles of the finger(s) and thumb, but the picking energy of frailing is produced by the arm and shoulder, with chest and back muscles, even stomach and leg muscles, involved--it's much more of a whole body effort. There's much the same difference between finger picking and flat picking the guitar. I'm not suggesting that good guitar (and banjo) finger pickers don't swing: Merle Travis and Earl Scruggs sure do. But it seems to me that frailing and flatpicking are a form of dancing: when the whole body is bouncing, rhythm comes easy. One other thing I noticed about my discourse: I said about doublethumbing that it was finger up, thumb up, and in a sense it is (both are up in that they are away from the banjo head), but the finger and thumb are of course working in opposite directions, so finger up, thumb down, finger up, thumb down. --seed |
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10 Sep 98 - 04:12 AM (#37746) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: murray@mpce.mq.edu.au Bseed, I did read the rest of your post; but not owning a banjo at the moment, and not really being familiar with the feel of one, I found it hard to follow. However I did download the thread for future reading, as if I ever get me a banjo, the information will be very usefull I have noticed that Son House, unlike the other country blues players, swings at the wrist when he plays. The other players of his school seem to use the minimum of hand and are all fingers Murray |
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10 Sep 98 - 11:58 AM (#37776) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Art Thieme Bill Foster (in Alabama),
Yes, we did do some workshops at Winfield together! Good memories from the dozen years I played there. I'm pretty sure I've got a slide o' you and the family I took there---you're all dressed in red. Aren't you going back there this year? All the best & thanks for the memories, Art |
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10 Sep 98 - 12:42 PM (#37782) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Bert Seed, ....so finger up, thumb down, finger up, thumb down. Reminds me of that kids action song Couldn't find it in DT so here 'tiz. One finger, one thumb keep moving, One finger, one thumb keep moving, One finger, one thumb keep moving, and we'll all have a jolly good time. Two fingers, two thumbs keep moving, Two fingers, two thumbs keep moving, Two fingers, two thumbs keep moving, and we'll all have a jolly good time. Two fingers, two thumbs, one arm keep moving.... Two fingers, two thumbs, two arms keep moving.... Two fingers, two thumbs, two arms, one leg keep moving.... Two fingers, two thumbs, two arms, two legs keep moving.... Two fingers, two thumbs, two arms, two legs, a nod of the head keep moving.... Two fingers, two thumbs, two arms, two legs, a nod of the head, stand up and sit down keep moving.... Two fingers, two thumbs, two arms, two legs, a nod of the head, stand up and sit down, stand up and turn 'round keep moving.... Bert. |
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04 Feb 00 - 09:40 PM (#173772) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: bseed(charleskratz) I thought I'd revive this thread both for its content and to add some new, useful information: My favorite clawhammer player is Dwight Diller, a West Virginia player who spent some time playing with Galax bands in a Galax style clawhammer but got homesick for the WV style he'd learned from oldtimers in his home area. He now gives many workshops, mostly near his home, but he's willing to travel: his workshops are usually four to seven days in length, very intensive, starting with lots of work on the right hand to get the rhythm right before going very deeply into tunes (I haven't been to one but I read a fairly detailed description of one accompanying his CD "Just Banjo" which is just that, a bunch of tunes beautifully played, with notes on tuning included for each song: it's kind of an instruction program without text. He also has a couple of instructionaly videos out (I have the intermediate level tape; the beginning video was supposedly ready to release early this winter). Dwight has a website: www.dwightdiller.com which itself is very instructional, including tablature and real audio files for about thirty tunes, many of them on "Just Banjo," along with biographical information about him and links to a banjo maker who offers a Dwight Diller line of old timey banjos (wooden tone rings) and to Diller's wife's folk arts store. --seed By the way, many of his tabs are amazingly simple, yet are very beautiful when he plays them--what sets his playing apart is his wonderful right hand. |
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04 Feb 00 - 10:40 PM (#173791) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Guy Wolff Hi Gang, The only thing to add is that Claw-hammer when realy souning right should sound like a pony trotting on cobble court. Finding the right spot up the neck a little to get a slight harmonic is a good trick to learn. I guess thats not in the first week of practice but still good to know.Have fun with it when you get an instroment!!! the best to you, Guy |
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04 Feb 00 - 11:01 PM (#173801) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Little Neophyte Thanks for refreshing this thread Charles. I printed out your posting. They are very helpful and timely for me right now. I found Dwight's site is an excellent resource. What are your thoughts on Dwight Diller's week long workshop that he calls 'banjo camp'. Just wondering if you know anyone who has attended? BB |
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04 Feb 00 - 11:43 PM (#173816) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: bseed(charleskratz) No, I don't, Bonnie--but I'd love to go to one. His intermediate video begins with him directing his son in demonstrating the right hand technique, damping the strings so that he's just working on rhythm; he starts with the one-two (one string frailed, four strings played), adds the thumbed fifth string at the "and" after the two: one--two-and, one--two-and, boom-tiddy, boom-tiddy rhythm, then adds the drop thumb at the "and" after the one for one-and-two-and boom and tiddy boom and tiddy rhythm. This goes on several minutes before he introduces a tune. Sunday nights at the Starry Plough I practice the stroke along with the band, damping the strings so I'm just playing a soft rhythm: different tunes allow me to practice the patterns at a variety of tempos. It's making a big difference in my actual playing. --seed |
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04 Feb 00 - 11:58 PM (#173827) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Little Neophyte Charles all the dates for this years workshops & camps are listed on Dwights website now. They weren't last time I checked. It is worth checking out. BB |
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05 Feb 00 - 04:01 AM (#173865) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Arkie I missed this the first time around and am happy to see it brought back. Are there any subtle differences in the in the downpicking style which is labeled clawhammer, rapping, and frailing? Or are they regional names? Here in the Ozarks the old timers like Bookmiller Shannon played pretty fast and were quite rthymic, possibly because the banjo was used to accompany square and jig dance along with the fiddle. Often the banjo and fiddle were the only instruments used for dance music. The oldtimers' playing was not as melodic as players I have heard further east. Generally speaking the Ozark frailers, played faster and with less single noting than their eastern counterparts. Several modern frailers not mentioned heretofore, but certainly worthy of note are Jim Connor, best known for his song, Grandma's Feather Bed, Gordy Hinners, and Mark Jones. Jim's skill on the banjo is nothing short of amazing. He can play the old fiddle tunes as well as anyone, but I can't begin to describe what else Jim does with the banjo, getting sounds and textures I have heard from no one else. Gordy plays a fretless banjo with Ralph Blizard and the New Southern Ramblers and gives that band a very distinctive sound. Ralph Blizard is a another story, a wonderful fiddler with a distinctive bowing technique, and a real treasure. The New Southern Ramblers are quite a band. Mark is the son of Grandpa Jones and a first class musician in his own right. |
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05 Feb 00 - 07:56 AM (#173875) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Banjer Mr. BSeed, Thanks for reviving this thread....I will check out Mr. Diller's website today. I am not too far off from buying that Deering Goodtime banjo that we discussed in the forum earlier. I had occasion to play one several months ago and fell in love with the light weight and nice tone of the instrument. Admittedly it looks kind of strange with the type of head it has on it (more like a guitar than traditional banjo) but it does sound good! Have you had any experience with one yet? (or anyone else for that matter?) |
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05 Feb 00 - 04:00 PM (#174026) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: bseed(charleskratz) Banjer, yes--I have played one, and I liked it (but also would prefer a more traditional appearance, banjo tuners in place of guitar, and a non-windswept head; even with its strange appearance I kind of wish I had bought one when I was in a store in Corvallis, Ore., which was selling them for $250, tax free, three years ago. Instead I bought a composite banjo--pot from an old tenor, custom made 17 fret neck: nice looking but probably not as good sounding as the Goodtime, and twice the price. --seed |
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05 Feb 00 - 06:01 PM (#174070) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Chris Seymour Glad to hear Gordy Hinners mentioned -- he's great -- met him when the Ramblers were running a string band class at Augusta Heritage Workshops in West Virginia in the early 90s. Far as I can tell, Arkie, there's no consistent, clear definitions that distinguish between clawhammer, rapping and frailing - I've read definitive statements from various sources that contradict each other. Best not to get too serious about the banjo. The operative word relating to the instrument is "play." |
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05 Feb 00 - 07:22 PM (#174099) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Sean Belt What a great thread! I started playing banjo in the old time clawhammer style about two years ago and it really turned my head around. It gave me a new interest in and excitement about playing music that had been flagging in me for a while. Another good resource for video lessons in this style is David Holt. His tapes area available through Happy Traum's Homespun Tapes. I recommend them highly. - Sean |
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05 Feb 00 - 09:36 PM (#174157) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: GUEST,Arnie There will be an interesting 5 string banjo convention called The Maryland Banjo Academy on April 7,8,9. It will feature top notch players in a few styles teaching banjo classes, giving workshops, and concerts. It will also feature many good banjo makers selling product. Some of the fine clawhammerists will be Dwight Diller, Cathy Fink, Walt Koken, Reed Martin, Debby McClatchy, Ken Perlman, Art Rosenbaum, Tony Trischka, Bob Carlin. The prices seem very reasonable for this event. For more info contact Nancy Nitchie at 410-643-3612. Clawhammer player Dan Levenson does workshops travelling accross the U.S.A. with a bunch of Deering Goodtime banjos for folks to play. I think they are a fine beginner instrument, with reasonable tone - but when you turn into a banjo playing maniac, you'll probably want to get something better. |
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06 Feb 00 - 06:01 PM (#174226) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Arkie Another player who pretty much utilizes this style is Leroy Troy, the Tennessee Slicker. The thing that sets Leroy apart is his showmanship. He does a lot of the tricks with the banjo, while playing, that Uncle Dave Macon was known for. As he once said, "It takes a lot of room for me to play a banjo". He is certainly fun to watch as he slings his banjo around in circles and arcs while playing tunes such as "Grandfather's Clock". While Leroy imitates Uncle Dave's tricks he does not perform very many of the tunes from Macon's repertoire. Hugh 'Doc' Wilhite, a Kentucky physician, on the other hand does an excellent recreation of a Dave Macon performance including the patter, songs, and tricks. |
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06 Feb 00 - 09:25 PM (#174330) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: BanjoRay I went to 2 four day banjo workshops that Dwight Diller took here in England in the last year and a half. The guy is a totally dedicated teacher, who works his rocks off to get his class playing good solid rhythmic clawhammer in the style of the WV Hammons family banjo players. I've been playing clawhammer since the sixties, and Dwight really got my ideas bucked up. I'd recommend one of his banjo camps to anybody who wants to get a real feel for what clawhammer playing is all about. Someone wanted to know what the Deering Goodtime banjos were like; I've played a couple of them, and they are superb value for what you pay for them. They have maple bodies and necks and no tone ring, only weigh 4 pounds, and sound surprisingly good for what is a pretty cheap new banjo. They are not very pretty, but I could stand the sight of one - I'm seriously considering getting one as a back-packing banjo! Cheers Ray |
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06 Feb 00 - 10:16 PM (#174342) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Chris Seymour Where are these Deerings available; how much do they cost now; and is there an online image of them that anyone knows of so I can see what they look like? |
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07 Feb 00 - 09:54 AM (#174462) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: GUEST,Jeff Morrison For a Goodtime call Jeff. I just happen to know of a picture of one. http://www.interlog.com/~jmor/music/folk.htm |
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07 Feb 00 - 11:10 AM (#174504) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: black walnut who's that unidentified singer/dulcimer player you're pictured performing with, jeff? she looks familiar..... ~black walnut |
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07 Feb 00 - 11:26 AM (#174507) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: dick greenhaus Y'all should realize that the folk didn't use all these names--if you asked a real folk banjo picker what he was playing, he'd generally respond, "banjo". The first time I heard the term claw-hammer was in the mid 50s, in Seeger's mimeographed "How to Play the 5-String Banjo". I believe he was describing the hand position for three-fingered (Scruggs) picking. What's generally called claw-hammer today was generallycalled drop-thumbing--a technique that used the thumb twicew in each phrase to play more melody. FRailing (or down-picking) left out more notes, or relied on hammering-on or pulling-off to achieve them. "Frail", BTW, is a southernism synonamous to "beat", as in "if you don' behave yo' self, ah'm gonna frail you good!" dick |
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07 Feb 00 - 01:01 PM (#174558) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: GUEST,kate bucko kcbucko@hotmail.com i agree with the statment about the terminology...i play banjo, and i just go a-pickin'. i didn't really realize i was playing clawhammer. i just dont like to use picks... |
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07 Feb 00 - 02:06 PM (#174585) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Songster Bob Well, lots of good grist for the mill here. Some comments, plus an embedded ad. One question was about the tuning or pitch at which you play the five-string and a question about "kinds of banjo." Originally, the five-string was about the size of the modern instrument, but, as "banjo orchestras" were invented and became extremely popular, the inventors and makers devised specialized instruments for the different musical voices, from soprano to bass. That piccolo banjo mentioned early on in this thread was the lead instrument, the soprano voice, and the "normal" banjo was re-designated the "tenor" banjo (which causes some confusion with the later invention of a cello-tuned four-string plectrum instrument now called the "tenor banjo.") Luckily, the folk players didn't get so caught up in the urban banjo orchestra craze, and just played the thing. Clawhammer playing is generally identified now* as what the old-timers called "knocking," "frailing," "beating," "rapping," and several other names. The tendency to require names for styles seems a folkloric trait, and lorists deserve what they get in these cases. Someone once asked old-timer Buell Kazee what he called his style. His answer: "I've been playing since I was five years old, and I'm nigh onto seventy now. As long as I can remember, we always called it 'picking' the banjo." * I once read a book, published in the '50s, which called the three-finger Scruggs-oriented style "clawhammer," so the term has been applied to both styles at one time. That usage has pretty much died out, it seems. The hard part about the knocking style is to get used to realy striking the strings instead of plucking them, even if you use the nail. The hand comes down in a striking motion, hitting individual strings or groups of strings, depending on what's needed. The basic pattern is strike/pause/brush/thumb, giving a ONE and-a beat (i.e., two repeats per measure of 2/4 fiddle-tune rhythm). I always think of Pete Seeger's mnemonic "Bum-titty, bum-titty" for a measure of banjo playing. That pause is when the hand rebounds for the next down stroke, and the thumb after the "tit" part is NOT a pluck in terms of moving the thumb, but is instead a lift of the whole hand, the thumb having come to rest on the 5th string at the end of the down brush of the hand. In other words, the thumb, by lifting the hand, helps get the hand ready for more down-strokes and incidentally sounds the tumb string (it does pluck the string, of course, but it's not a "fishing expedition" or actually separate motion). Old-time banjos up until about 1920 were strung with gut strings (with a wound 4th string, not a metal string as such), but are typically nowadays strung with wire. Some folks still prefer the gut (or its replacement, nylon) string sound. I have five banjos -- two gut-strung, two steel-strung, and one interchangeable. One each of the gut- and steel-strung instruments is fretted, the other is fretless. So I can get the sound I want from the banjo that matches it. Commercial advertisement -- I am the publisher and writer of "The Old-timey Banjo Book," which I still have copies of. I'll sell 'em for $7.50 postpaid. Email me at rjclayton@aol.com for a mailing address. A few 'catters have the books, and I hope they have been helpful (the books, not the 'catters). This has gotten long enough that I will stop now. I'll check back on the thread later to see if there are any other unanswered questions (like "You didn't mention drop-thumb playing."). Bob Clayton rjclayton@aol.com |
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02 Mar 00 - 01:58 PM (#188203) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Rex Well I was curious about Bob's book. He's got good credentials, hanging out with those Smithsonian folks and all. So I ordered one from him. It arrived last week but it wasn't until last night that I was able to break out a banjo and look through it. I was getting it with another picker starting out in mind. But there was things in there to help me too. A pulloff there where I hadn't thought of it, and I never could do that drop thumb stuff. He also tells of some of those delightful alternate tunings and how to get there from "G" and what to do when you get there. Now mind you, this book was done in '76. The old bicentennial. There weren't no CAD and there weren't no wordprocessors. You won't find full color images and fancy fonts. This book was made by hand. It's well laid out with good diagrams and some nice drawings placed here and there. There's even a drawing of Bob on the back. Though judging from his mudcat photo, he don't look as youthful as he did in '76. Well neither do I. Anyway, Bob don't know me from Adam. I'm just letting you folks know that here's a good book if you want to learn old-time banjo and it's well worth the price. Rex |
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02 Mar 00 - 03:26 PM (#188259) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Uncle_DaveO Speaking of Seeger's descriptive expression for the rhythm, "bum-titty", Dwight Diller says for his style that's all wrong. It should be (bum) titty-BUM, titty-BUM, titty-BUM, titty-BUM. Dave Oesterreich |
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02 Mar 00 - 03:32 PM (#188268) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Mooh Sorry I haven't read every letter here. Has anybody mentioned Ken Pearlman? Great clawhammer guy, with instruction books I think. |
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02 Mar 00 - 04:28 PM (#188299) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Hardiman the Fiddler Been enjoying this thread, cause I also play some banjo. Probably I'm not as technical as all the advise in this thread, but the one thing I remember was it was hard to use finger picks for the Scruggs style, and it was hard at first to keep the last two fingers of the right hand anchored on the banjo head while I was learning, so I just strummed the banjo for a while, till I got used to the three finger rolls. In that era, someone informed me I was playing "claw hammer" style, that was news to me! Then an old-timer told me that the style was called claw hammer because you held your hand as though it was a hammer, brushing with the nails, and then lastly catching the fifth string with the thumb, like it was the claw of the hammer. I doubt I do it right, but I liked the advise earlier. The operative word is "play!" good luck. HTF |
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02 Mar 00 - 05:44 PM (#188370) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: GUEST, Bryant Great thread. I'm a novice banjo player (I had a friend give me her unused-sitting-in-the-garage banjo) and I only pick it up now and then, when I get burned out on guitar. Anyway, I've got a couple of questions for the experts. First, I hate finger picks and have pretty much decided to abandon them. Now, I realize that Scruggs style/bluegrass picking almost requires them in order to get that crisp sound. What I'm wondering is whether some (or most) of the old time players (like Uncle Dave Macon, Bascom Lunsford, and Clarance Ashley) played bare fingered. Or did they use finger picks too? Also, could someone explain in a little more detail how some of those old time players get that "Clipity-clop" sound? On some recordings of Clarance Ashley ("The Coo-coo Bird") it's so clear you'd almost swear someone was playing wood blocks in the background. Does it have to do with where you pluck the strings or how? I've been baffled by this for some time now. Thanks, Bryant |
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02 Mar 00 - 06:09 PM (#188395) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: GUEST,Snakespit Hi: I started off a great many years ago on banjo, then moved to guitar for most of my life, and a few years ago came back to banjo. Not an expert, I have done lots of reading & playing, & have enjoyed the thread so far. A couple of notes (pun, get it?): the minstrel-style method was generally called "stroke", or down-picking, and several of the old tutor books are still in print and readily available. If you give your instrument to someone who hasn't played, or to a child, they most often will brush the back of the right hand (nali side) across the strings, from top to bottom (physically, but actually bottom to top in pitch, ie bass to treble - Lord, why are we so perverse in our terminology?), so as far as I can see, the "natural" stroke is that of the clawhammer style. Both terms have been used interchangeably for many years, and it's only been recently that the definitions have been refined. These days, "frailing" is generally used to describe a kind of chunky, all-fingers stroke, or one which mostly backs up the fiddle player, providing rhythm and adding such melody notes as he/she can find. "Clawhammer" is more often used to describe a style, part of which is also called "melodic" - more a solo or lead style which Ken Perlmann and many others have developed into a very intricate modern way of playing (paradoxic as that may sound for old-tyme music). There are also many idiosycracies and personal techniques which provide an endless array of variations on style. There are also dozens of tunings, some quite bizarre, which add an exotic sound to many of the old mountain songs, and echo the origins of those songs in the old modal scales used before "modern" music swept the scene. The banjo is a fascinating study, and there are some fine recent books I can highly recommend - "Ring the Banjar" and "That Half-Barbaric Twang" are a couple of excellent histories of the instrument from different perspectives. Check the on line booksellers and you'll find them. Finally, the banjo's fascination is part sound, part history of music and machinery, part social weathervane. There's always more to learn and hear, and the diversity of style and opinion keeps it strong - it's a very democratic instrument. What's important is to play, or to learn, or to observe in your own style and to your own taste. As has been said to me too many times: "You can tell when the stage is level because the banjo player is drooling from both sides of his mouth". - |
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02 Mar 00 - 07:03 PM (#188433) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Uncle_DaveO Bryant, you asked about whether the old-time players-- and you mentioned several names--play(ed) with fingerpicks or their own nails. The answer is "generally their own nails." I'm a relative newbie to clawhammer banjo--a little less than two years. It took me about eight months to get the basic frailing stroke down right. Then within a couple of months thereafter I was able to sing over a rhythmic pattern, and play banjo breaks between verses on a number of the songs. I learned double-thumbing and drop-thumbing, the techniques that are usually thought to distinguish clawhammer from frailing, right along with the early lessons. Today I'm self-directing (no more lessons), and almost everything I play I've worked out myself from hearing or remembering or imagining a tune; don't use tab to speak of at all. I should say that I much prefer playing with my own fingernail (middle), but it keeps breaking, so I have to use a pick a good deal of the time. Oh, and you mentioned, among others, Bascomb Lamar Lunsford. He didn't frail; he used a two-finger up-picking style. Dave Oesterreich |
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02 Mar 00 - 07:14 PM (#188442) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Hardiman the Fiddler You get the "clipetty, cloppity," by developing a roll---three fingered style---which unfortunately means getting used to using picks. I hated the picks at first. But then, when I got more used to them, I began to love the volume of sound that you could get out of the banjo. Now, I never play without picks. To develop a roll, first you got to remember to keep your two little fingers anchored on the head of the banjo---otherwise your hand goes sailing around all over the place, like a fresh caught trout. Second, you gotta develop a smoothness in the timing of the roll. Start slow, then you can build up speed. I used to use a metronome. Once you built up speed, you can varr syncopate the roll to get the clip clop sound. Hardiman the Fiddler |
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02 Mar 00 - 08:42 PM (#188495) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Stewie On the subject of books, I noted a reference to the following recent publication - issued by Mel Bay Publications, with CD: Brad Leftwich 'Round Peak Style Clawhammer Banjo'. --Stewie. |
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02 Mar 00 - 08:50 PM (#188504) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Uncle_DaveO Contrary to Hardiman's explanation, the "cluck" is not achieved by a roll, as the Bluegrassers operate, nor does it require picks. The next outboard finger, I'll call it, beyond the stroking finger is kept in position to strike against the next string just after the prime frailing stroke, and the collision of that nail and next string does the job. So I've been told by authorities on Banjo-L, the banjo e-mail distribution list. The "cluck" is a startlingly hard crack, and for some occasional pieces it can be very interesting. But if a banjoist uses it all the time, as some do, it becomes annoying to the listener. I'd like to learn it one of these days; being told in general how it's done and getting it clear how and internalizing it are different matters. Dave Oesterreich |
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02 Mar 00 - 10:36 PM (#188550) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Oversoul Buy all the old-time genre CD's you can afford and a few basic frailing/clawhammer books. The Bible is by John Burke, an old Oak Publication. Just get a of couple books, however. They get very redundant as this is not rocket science. Then get two banjos. An open-back and a resonator. Mid-grade banjos sound as good as the most expensive, let the buffoons cry foul, this is a fact. Always think of making your banjo wish it was a fiddle. All the rest of the stuff is up to you. Work on dynamics and intonation as you progress, and listen to all sorts of acoustic music from all over the world. There are lots of similar instruments in other cultures which will give you endless inspiration. Trust me and avoid the "technocrats", we all have different types of hands and ears! The type of sound you want to make will emerge with time. |
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20 Sep 00 - 11:50 PM (#301963) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: bseed(charleskratz) Since my link to this thread in the other clawhammer discussion didn't seem to have much effect, I thought I'd refresh it. --seed |
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21 Sep 00 - 01:45 PM (#302386) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: GUEST,John Leeder Coming in late (as usual), picking up on a few random points: Another way of hardening the fingernails is to eat lots of Jello and/or take gelatin capsules. At a Mariposa Festival one year I saw Kyle Creed frail using a finger-pick of his own invention. I've never seen anyone else use a pick. To muddy the waters a little, there's a guitar finger-picking style called "clawhammer". My former brother-in-law, from England, played what he called the "Regency clawhammer", which he learned while working in Belgium in the '60s. I couldn't describe the style from memory, and he hasn't been my brother-in-law for a lot of years now, so I can't check with him. I'm also under the impression that some people use "clawhammer" the way others use "melodic clawhammer", i.e., lots of melody notes, less rhythmic, and use "frailing" for the more "brushy", rhythmic style, instead of using "clawhammer" interchangeably with "frailing". Lastly, does anyone else out there frail with an anchor, i.e., keeping the little finger on the head? By the time that I found out it was impossible (Pete Seeger's book, I think) it was too late to quit. You gain a lot in precision but lose in attack, volume and traditional sound. It's good to have a louder instrument to play this style. (Mine was made by Jake Neufeld and has an old-fashioned bell-brass tone ring.) It works well for the melodic clawhammer style. The only other person I've seen frailing with an anchor was a bluegrasser trying to demonstrate frailing and, I think, remembering it imperfectly. Am I all alone out here? |
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21 Sep 00 - 10:00 PM (#302744) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Bill in Alabama John-- I'm certainly not the authority on it, but, in my 35 years of clawhammer playing, I have never seen anyone play old-time banjo with an anchor. I thought I would never break the anchor habit when, after several years as a bluegrass and melodic picker, I decided to learn clawhammer also, but the difference the free right hand makes in the clawhammer playing is worth the trouble. I still play all styles and enjoy them all, but clawhammer is my favorite (probably due to my having grown up in the Appalachians, which gave me an early exposure to that style). Bill |
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22 Sep 00 - 01:34 PM (#303192) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: GUEST,John Leeder With tongue in cheek, I tell people I play "Leeder style" and that I'm the best in the world at it. But I may be the only one as well. |
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22 Sep 00 - 11:07 PM (#303613) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Guy Wolff With 30 years of frailing at square dances and the like someone just lent me a tape with Uncle Dave Macon playing "Down the old Plank road". If you want to hear some great Banjo give a listen to this song.Anything be Clarence Ashley and Lily May Ledford will always inspire me !!!. All the best, Guy |
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15 Jul 01 - 11:26 AM (#507013) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: wysiwyg refresh |
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15 Jul 01 - 01:50 PM (#507102) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: Uncle_DaveO BSeed said: "Some clawhammer players use finger picks--backwards, of course--" That's the cart before the horse. Clawhammerers wear the picks with the picking surface over their nail (one of them), as God intended. Bluegrass players are less efficient, and have to use three plus a thumb-pick, probably because they make the mistake of wearing them backward, with the picking surface over the fleshy part of the finger, a great heresy. Dave Oesterreich |
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16 Jul 01 - 12:30 AM (#507421) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: TishA Great thread. I wasn't here when this discussion began. Glad you brought it back WYSIWYG (Susan isn't it?) I don't play clawhammer, I play two finger style. Most of the things I do are common to clawhammer only I pick up not down. This is the true way as it was ordained by god. Banjo "picking" is what it's called. Clawhammer players call themselves "pickers" but they're doing it all backwards. This is why banjoists are thought of as backwards. As clawhammer was once the predominant banjo style in the southern mountains we who live here have long been thought of as a backwards people by the rest of the world. It's a terrible load of guilt that frailers must carry for all this. Aside from that..............Friday night Tish & I were listening to a fiddler play one tune after another in 6/8 time. I became fasinated and started working things out as soon as we got home. This ain't too easy with a two finger style! Anybody else doing this either clawhammer or two finger style? I love the sound and feel of 6/8. I have it on the best authority that God made the fingernails grow out past the end of the finger so that strings could be "picked" upwards as was his plan from before the foundations of the world. Chip A.
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20 Aug 01 - 02:31 PM (#531946) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: GUEST refresh |
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20 Aug 01 - 04:42 PM (#532009) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: DougR John in Brisbane: you story about the banjo case gave me my laugh of the day. Great story. Don't know how I missed it in '98. DougR |
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20 Aug 01 - 09:35 PM (#532152) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: GUEST,Dave in England I've just found this thread and have read all the entries for the last year or so and found them very interesting. I'd like to ad a few words into the discussion if I, as an Englishman, can be so presumptious. I believe that 'frailing' 'drop-thumb' 'clawhammer' or whatever one calls this rapping, down-driving style, has developed a mystique around it that is unwarrented. It wasn't, as some people claim, the predominant style in the Appalachians, only one of several regional styles, two-finger picking, was very popular in some regions, as was pre-Scruggs three-finger picking, also,of course, what Pete Seeger called 'up-picking' or 'the basic'strum'. In my experience all these styles have a place and a role to play depending on the song, style, rhythm, needed for any given performance. The good old 'knockdown style' of players such as Cousin Emmy, and Uncle Dave Macon, is great for hell-for-leather songs and square-dance tunes, whereas 'clawhammer' or a more delicate 'drop-thumb' is great for slower pieces such as Clarence Ashley's 'Cuckoo'. 'Up-picking' as performed by Derroll Adams and Buel Kazee is an ideal song-accompanying style. And I find that a simple 'two-finger' style alternating between 'double-thumbing' 'pinching' and the odd 'brush' the perfect accompaniment for slow ballads such as Obray Ramsay's 'Little Margaret'. 'In England the Old Timey community which is growing all the time has become fixated on 'drop-thumb frailing' and very few people use anything else, which is a shame as it means other styles don't get heard and much Old Timey banjo in Britain, and in the U.S. is very samey, this along with the usual line-up of banjo, fiddle and guitar, makes eventually for a rather predictable, boring, repetitive sound. The rule with folkmusic is that there are no rules, traditional players developed their own styles,frequently in isolation from other players, and dependant on type of banjo -fretless (a la Frank Proffitt, resonator-backed - Wade Ward, open-backed fretted etc... musical aptitude, manual dexterity, musical background -did father, grand-father, Uncle play ? Did itinerant black workers pass through area? Standardisation was unknown, there were as many types of banjo (from Seers and Robuck's finest to home-made tack-head banjo's made from catskins, sieves, and a few odd bits of lumber), styles of playing them, ways of singing the songs, variety of tunes and tune varients, as there were people. It's only in the folk revival that we have to pigeon-hole, categorize, and pin-down the music like some butterfly in a museum case. There is no correct version of any tune, only good or bad versions and renditions, there is no 'correct' style of playing the banjo (if it works for you then it's right), and nobody out there, not even Dwight Diller, is any more right than you are.All he can do, and seems to want to do, is to teach his pupils a very specific sub-style as performed by the Hammons family who influenced him as a young man. If you want to sound like Dwight Diller clones then learn from him by all means but you'd be much better off listening to half a dozen, a dozen, or a hundred, traditional and revival banjo players, and synthesising the things you hear into a style or styles that suit your, needs, temperament, instrument, musical needs etc., and then you'll sound like yourself, and one day people will be pulling up outside your house and asking you to show them what you do. A last couple of thought - again, there's no right or wrong when it come to playing with nails, bare-flesh or reversed picks, there are fine banjo players playing in all these styles. People such as Ken Perlman put a small piece of Scotch tape over their nail and tuck it in behind the nail, this seems to last him for several numbers. After years of trying every and anything to stop my nails wearing out I have finally settled on acrylic nails, painted on as a wet cement and which sets rock hard (Martin Simpson uses the same stuff) and can be filed and shaped as short or as long as required, It hasn't quite got the bell-like quality that playing off a natural nail gives, but being virtually indestructable it takes away a whole problem area of playing and allows one to concentrate on the playing and not worry about how long the nail will last. The material is the same as that used for false-teeth plates and if you want some sort of nail cover I recommend it unreservedly. Of course, some people get a great clear sound off the top of their finger/s with hardly any nail at all. Again, there's no right or wrong sound or way of achieving it, it's what works for you. Two of my favourite banjo players are Ron Mullinex (WV), and Art Rosenbaum (GA) - Art, like Mike Seeger, is a fluent player in all the styles mentioned above, and like Mike, has spent as much time as anyone recording, interviewing and listening to the old time players. Wishing all you pickers across the pond the very best, from Dave in England. |
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10 Sep 01 - 04:32 PM (#546543) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: GUEST,Ed_in_SouthCarolina I read the following old posting by Bill in Alabama. "I learned the style from a fine gentleman known as Uncle Arthur Kuykendall, who used a "drop-thumb" style in which he used his thumb on all strings rather than just the fifth." I remember Mr. Kuyendall's name when I was living in Huntsville. I think he also taught one the banjoi picker's in the Kingston Trio? Jim Conners? This was several years ago.. e must have been a great banjo picker, his name continues on over the South.
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26 Jan 22 - 09:40 PM (#4133975) Subject: RE: What is clawhammer style From: GUEST,Julian Currie I know this is WAY out of date but, it is So cool to see people talking about Uncle Arthur kuykendall. That’s my great great grandfather. I learned piano from his daughter(my grandmother) his photo sat above the piano and he watched me learn music as a kid. I heard so many great stories and even visited with the family. He did teach jim Conners. |