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08 Apr 04 - 12:54 AM (#1157207) Subject: BS: chicken flu From: dianavan All of the poulty in the Fraser Valley is being exterminated because of the avian virus. There is a fear of a pandemic. If you want to know more about this, check out the thread called...Euphenisms??? I kid you not. This is a serious topic. It will eventually reach your backyard if we don't get it a handle on this soon. It is no longer confined to Asia but is right here in N. America. Read the other thread and tell me what you think. d |
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08 Apr 04 - 07:45 AM (#1157333) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: MC Fat Cluck, cluck cluck, attishoo, cluck, cluck cluck, attishoo |
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08 Apr 04 - 09:11 AM (#1157405) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: sledge Bless you! Kleenex? |
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08 Apr 04 - 09:34 AM (#1157428) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: MC Fat Lemsip for Chickens please |
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08 Apr 04 - 09:45 AM (#1157437) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: sledge If they're not well they may have to stay couped up in bed. |
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08 Apr 04 - 10:02 AM (#1157445) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: MC Fat Eggsactly |
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08 Apr 04 - 10:05 AM (#1157451) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: sledge But if the Govt says they have to go, then they are well clucked. |
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08 Apr 04 - 11:57 AM (#1157545) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: ced2 Were they Jenny's Chickens and did they catch it because they were not wearing their bobble hats during the Hen's March to the Midden? |
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08 Apr 04 - 12:36 PM (#1157582) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: GUEST,heric It has a 70% mortality rate in the 32 people who have been infected. It easily crosses between bird species. It spreads easily in wild duck populations without early symptomology. It is geographically widespread. The time is now to make vaccine decisions for next year's flu season. Good luck to us. I hear you DV. |
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08 Apr 04 - 10:52 PM (#1157705) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: dianavan I copied this from my post on the Euphemism thread. Too lazy to write it again. Back to the chickens. I am shocked that such drastic measures are being taken. The rest of you should pay attention, here, because they are talking about a pandemic! It does, however, seem like a knee jerk reaction. They are not even sure if it will work to exterminate the poultry. What are they going to do about the wild birds? I am especially curious about this topic because of the association between chickens and the flu vaccine. I had a flu shot that backfired. My scalp broke out in red, swollen, itchy, oozing sores. No lie. It was disgusting (thank God it gone). It took over a year to find out it was caused by a newly formed egg allergy. It seems that the vaccine was grown in an egg medium. My body rejected eggs the same way it would reject the flu virus. The vaccine has worn off and I can eat eggs again but only in small amounts. Of course, I see an immediate connection between vaccines grown in eggs and the new strain of avian flu. Maybe they should be a little more careful about their vaccines and realize that these viruses have a nasty way of skipping across species. I can't believe they expect to contain this virus by killing the living. Quarantine would probably be far more effective. Why not let it run its course the way we do with the flu? Contain it, yes. Eradicate it - I doubt it! |
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09 Apr 04 - 09:35 PM (#1158348) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: Shanghaiceltic Chicken flu? Chicken pox? Dont sleep with chickens! |
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09 Apr 04 - 10:36 PM (#1158387) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: Metchosin dianavan, avian influenza is endemic in the North American wild bird population. It is pretty certain that the original infection of BC poultry came from the wild birds. So much for free range chickens when you have a few flocks of migratory birds on your farm too. |
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10 Apr 04 - 12:22 AM (#1158443) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: dianavan Thanks Metchosin, That sounds about right. So why do they think they can eradicate the virus from poultry farms? If wild birds have it won't it just continue to spread? I don't get it. Schools are crowded too but if a student gets the flu, they don't come in and kill all the other kids. I understand they fear a pandemic. What is this all about? |
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10 Apr 04 - 01:39 AM (#1158468) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: Metchosin I assume that, as far as battery raised chickens go, they figure they can isolate the new chicks from any wild migratory birds after the buildings have been declared clean. Unlike schools you can't exactly send sick and dying chickens home until the chicken coop is declared uninfected. I suspect they are doing a bit of overkill because the strain spread farther than they initially expected and so quickly. The reasoning probably is to get rid of all the risk they possibly can and start once again in uninfected premises. Although the initial infection was believed to be from wild birds, the rapid spread to other farms was considered to have been by human means, ie machinery, workers etc. so they are going to have to be a bit more scrupulous in that regard, in the future. Although the virus seems relatively benign in wild birds, ( the mortality rate is low) it would seem to mutate to more virulent strains once it gets into the crowded conditions of domestic poultry. So heartbreaking, aside from the economic repercussions. I imagine, if the goverment announced that all my perfectly healthy, beautiful pigeons that I raised as a kid, had to be destroyed, I would have been devastated. Its not just large comercial operations where chickens, turkeys and ducks are being slaughtered, but small backyard stuff regarding other bird species as well. |
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10 Apr 04 - 01:14 PM (#1158596) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: Ebbie It has a 70% mortality rate in the 32 people who have been infected. heric CDC Quote: ..."preliminary evidence that one person involved in culling operations on March 13 and 14 had developed unilateral conjunctivitis and upper respiratory symptoms on March 16. The diagnosis of influenza A (H7) was confirmed by both reverse transcription–polymerase chain reaction and cell culture of material obtained from a nasal swab. The culler was treated with oseltamivir, and all symptoms resolved On April 2, a second laboratory-confirmed case in a poultry worker was reported by Health Canada to the World Health Organization. This person had close contact with poultry on March 22 and 23 and developed a unilateral conjunctivitis and headache on March 25. The person was treated with oseltamivir and the illness has resolved. While these are the only laboratory-confirmed cases of avian influenza A (H7) in humans during the current outbreak, approximately 10 other poultry workers exhibited conjunctival and/or upper respiratory symptoms after having contact with poultry." I don't understand the "70% mortality rate". Is there further information? |
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10 Apr 04 - 02:17 PM (#1158644) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: Metchosin Perhaps heric has the outbreak of the strain of Avian Influenza in BC confused with the outbreak of the strain that occurred in Southeast Asia. When I said it was virulent I was referring to the effect in poultry, not humans. |
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10 Apr 04 - 03:31 PM (#1158713) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: GUEST,heric Thanks Metchosin you are exactly correct. I realized shortly thereafter that H7 was not H5 but the thread seemed to be dying like a choked chicken anyway, and here it is with new life breathing into it. |
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10 Apr 04 - 03:51 PM (#1158737) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: GUEST,heric Which is not to say that H5N1 doesn't scare the heck out of me. |
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10 Apr 04 - 03:58 PM (#1158747) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: Ebbie But, heric, unless you have later information, even in Asia the mortality rate is not even close to 70%, being more like 30%. Not that that isn't scary in itself- but it's a far cry from the larger figure. |
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10 Apr 04 - 04:09 PM (#1158759) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: GUEST,heric Ebbie here's a quote: "The virus has jumped to humans 34 times, with 24 deaths, many of them children. The most recent death, a 12-year-old Vietnamese boy, was disclosed Saturday." http://www.ajc.com/news/content/news/0304/24birdflu.html I'm no virologist, but I simply divided 24/34. I'm no virologist, but is it not true that one little mutation takes us to human-human transmission and . . . . (Metchosin - can you help us both out on this - you seem to have some scientific savvy.) |
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10 Apr 04 - 04:19 PM (#1158766) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: GUEST,heric This is the best overview I have seen: WHO FAQ |
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10 Apr 04 - 05:47 PM (#1158830) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: Ebbie I agree. It sounds bad. It does seem odd that on the one hand, these regions are slacking their surveillance and on the other hand rather cavaliarly toss off the figures of an extraordinarily high rate of mortality. |
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10 Apr 04 - 09:08 PM (#1158935) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: Shanghaiceltic Chicken flu has been rife in southern China for a long time now. Guangdong province which borders Hong Kong SAR has always seemed to be the point at which it has started. Ditto with SARS. A few weeks ago the Chinese government carried out a lot of culls, not just in Guangdong but also in provinces further north including the Shanghai municipality. Both open farms and battery farms had their chickens killed. It is not just the types of farmers that spread the disease in China but also the cleansiness of animal wholesale markets. If you have never been to one then dont put it down on your list of things to do in China. They are filthy, stinking areas where there is almost no regard for hygene. The treatment of the animals (both domesticated and always very many varieties of wild animals) would in most western countries mean that they were shut down and people prosecuted. That does not happen in China. The farms themselves are little better. Farming here bares no resemblance to a country farm in the west. In China many of the farmers and their families live alongside the animals in little more than adobe huts with little or no sanitation. Hence the spread of avain flu in China is much easier. Unless the WHO clamps down on China and other countries in the Far East then avian flu and ohter animal diseases will continue to be transmitted worldwide. One Chinese Minsister objected to WHO intervention saying that the West was trying to limit China's growth. |
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12 Apr 04 - 04:30 PM (#1160140) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: dianavan How did they dispose of the chickens in China? Here, in B.C. they hauled them to the dump in plastic bags, dug a hole and covered them with clay. In Britain, they incinerated the cows. People here are disgusted and alarmed. The govt. said it was a matter of feasibility. |
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17 Apr 04 - 02:00 AM (#1163732) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: GUEST,Nikki Why won't they tell us what the symptoms are for the chickens, I have looked everywere and I can't find them! How are we suppose to know when they have got it! |
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17 Apr 04 - 02:20 AM (#1163738) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: dianavan Your chickens would be sick. If they're organic, free range, there's little chance that the flock would be effected. Its the large, poultry farms where the infection is a problem, due to close quarters and unsanitary conditions. At least, thats the latest I've heard so far. Apparently, it has spread over a 35 K area. The Feds were gassing them, putting them in plastic bags and burying them in clay. Residents protested when they tried to use local landfills. Now B.C. is in control and their approach is much saner. They take the dead poultry, cover it with chicken manure and sawdust and let the heat of the compost destroy the virus on site. |
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17 Apr 04 - 11:10 AM (#1163777) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: GUEST,BIG ANDY What do you give a chicken that has flu? I suppose chicken soup is bang out of order |
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17 Apr 04 - 11:28 PM (#1164149) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: Hrothgar I had a little bird, Its name was Enza. I opened up a window And influenza. |
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18 Apr 04 - 07:09 PM (#1164691) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: GUEST,woko That was a rime that came out in 1919 I think, and that was bird flu, and it killed more people then the 1st world war |
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18 Apr 04 - 08:34 PM (#1164735) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: Metchosin It is not entirely certain that the "Spanish Flu" of that time was a direct "mutation" of the avian flu virus to a strain which enabled direct human to human contact of the disease. Although humans can contact "bird flu" from poultry, the virus does not seem to be generally passed on from one person to another. The Spanish Flu is thought, by some researchers, to have been a strain of avian flu which infected swine and mutated in pigs to a strain that could be passed by human to human contact, although that is not entirely certain either Some insight here Heric, I haven't really looked in to what has been occurring in Asia recently, regarding human to human contact. It would seem though, that the human conditions in parts of China could be considered equivalent to the crowded conditions experienced by battery raised chickens and subsequently the usual breeding ground for pandemics. Regarding free range poultry, especially in the Fraser Valley, it would seem far more likely that free range birds, which are at a higher risk of exposure to the virus from migratory birds that winter there, would always be at greater risk, than poutry raised in an enclosed, somewhat controllable environment. So I would think that as long as you have free range poultry, you will always have the possibility of them contracting "bird flu". Ya pays yer money and ya takes yer chances. |
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19 Apr 04 - 12:53 PM (#1165352) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: GUEST,petr one thing I havent heard on any of the radio interviews and discussions on this topic here in BC is just how of the rapid spread of the virus has to do with the 'factory' farming of the chickens (ie. being raised in dark, cramped conditions just so the chickens increase in weight a lot faster). I also remember reading a new yorker article in the last year that made me think about eating factory raised chickens (ie. a huge pile of dead and dying chicks - when they clean out the building) Of course you will get scavenger birds, what do you see when you go to a dump - seagull, crows etc. no wonder some residents dont trust the govt and dont want them dumped in their landfill. I understand the main reason they want to nip this in the bud, is not because of the danger to humans from avian flu, but the danger of it mutating in to something worse. (only a month before the sars outbreak, last year I read a science magazine article about the threat of a massive flu virus. Apparently every few years as the influenza virus mutates, there may be an extremely virulent mutation once or twice a century - just like the spanish flu of 1919 which killed more people around the world than wwI. THe idea was that we are due for another big one, and the fact is that its far more likely to spread with modern air travel etc, and the scientists pushed for an end to the live markets in China. |
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19 Apr 04 - 01:07 PM (#1165359) Subject: RE: BS: chicken flu From: TheBigPinkLad Everything you wanted to know about the B.C. outbreak of avian flu but were afraid to ask: Click here |