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29 Apr 05 - 08:08 AM (#1474127) Subject: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: GUEST,Knights Templar Watch It sounds like the stuff of fiction but there is growing real-life controversy surrounding the new Pope. It involves not only the Knights Templar but also another authentic historical organisation whose name is so steeped in mystery and legend that most people do not believe that they ever existed: the Bavarian Illuminati. It has emerged that just weeks before he was elected Pope, choosing the name Benedict XVI, the former Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger was in discussion with a number of individuals and organisations in connection with an investigation into the Knights Templar and the Illuminati. Could this flurry of activity have been a desperate bid to move forward with an investigation into the Knights Templar before Ratzinger was elected Pope? Did the Cardinal know he was going to be the next pope before the official Conclave even began? Cardinal Ratzinger immediately took centre stage in the ceremonies following the death of his predecessor Pope John Paul II. The Conclave then convened and duly elected Ratzinger as the new Pope. So could the decision have been made in advance of the Conclave? Cardinal Ratzinger was the chief of the Congregation of the Doctrine for the Faith, which used to be called the Holy Inquisition. As Grand Inquisitor and the Pope's chief theological policeman, Ratzinger certainly wielded enormous influence within the Catholic Church. The Holy Inquisition under Pope Clement V was instrumental, along with King Phillip IV of France, in torturing and killing the leaders of the Knights Templar, starting on Friday 13th October 1307. The Templars were officially disbanded by the Church in 1312 and are understood to have continued in secret as a separate organisation in areas where there was great sympathy for them. Vatican documents recently revealed that the Pope held a secret trial in which the Templars were found to be innocent and yet the persecution continued. In the latest of a series of strange events in England, reporter Raymond Brown of the Hertfordshire Mercury, who has covered the Knights Templar extensively, received a mysterious anonymous phone call about the new Pope, urging the reporter to set out on an investigation of his own. The caller made seven cryptic, numbered points that have sparked renewed interest in the mysteries surrounding the new Pope, the Knights Templar and the Illuminati. The points were more or less as follows: 1) We have just seen the first conclave of the new millennium. 2) The new Pope knew he was going to be elected before it happened. 3) The new Pope grew up in Bavaria, the home of the Illuminati. 4) The new pope was the Grand Inquisitor of the Holy Inquisition, which fought the Templars and the Illuminati. 5) In his first speech as Pope, Benedict XVI made an interesting reference to the "vineyard." 6) The new pope has been investigating the Knights Templar and the Illuminati in Hertford. 7) Just before he was elected the new Pope contacted several groups and individuals, including Dr Alan Thomson, Acting Head of History at Hertfordshire University and Alison Tinniswood, Historic Environment Record Officer of the Environment Department of Hertfordshire County Council, about the Knights Templar in Hertfordshire. Hertfordshire Mercury Newspaper: Friday 29th April 2005, Page 28. www.herts-essex-news.co.uk/mercury/ The symbolic number seven seems to be significant in relation to the Knights Templar (along with the number 13.) There are seven points above. The persecution began in 1307. Next year the 13th of October 2006 falls on a Friday - Friday the 13th of October, the 699th anniversary of the persecution. In the following year the 13th of October 2007 will fall exactly seven centuries after the persecution of the Knights Templar began. (Perhaps this explains why strange events are starting to take place.) England appears to be the hub of the mysterious modern Templar activity. The post-separation Templars are believed to have a base underground in Hertfordshire, just outside England's capital. There are many tunnels and caves in the area that have been linked to the Knights Templar. The English flag is the red George cross on a white background. Its origin is the red cross of the Templars upon the white Templar mantle. England's patron saint is Saint George, the patron saint of Crusaders and the arms of the City of London include the Templars' red cross and a red sword - legacies of the capital's Templar history. Just four days after the election of Pope Benedict XVI, on Saturday 23rd April 2005, England and the Church celebrated St George's Day. The new Pope was then inaugurated on Sunday 24th April, the day after St George's Day. The Pope's chosen name, Benedict, may also be significant from a Templar point of view. The Templar rule was based on the Rule of St Benedict and their motto is also thought to have been Benedictine in origin. The media mostly reported that Joseph Ratzinger grew up in Germany. But in fact he is Bavarian. He was born and raised in the home of the Bavarian Illuminati and he is said to have a quiet private interest in the controversial secret society, which was founded there by Adam Weishaupt (who was born a Jew, raised a Jesuit and ended his life as an anti-clerical reformer) in 1776. The Elector of Bavaria issued edicts for the suppression of the Bavarian Illuminati on June 22 1784, which were repeated in March and August 1785, but the historical record shows that the Illuminati had already infiltrated numerous Masonic Lodges and it is said that by this time their influence had spread all over the world. It has been suggested by conspiracy theorists that the influence of the Illuminati is strongest within the Masonic Knights Templar, where they still form a secret society within a secret society. Does the Holy Inquisition still pursue the Knights Templar after seven centuries? Could a powerful secret society have infiltrated the Catholic Church, in the same way that, as historians acknowledge, the Illuminati infiltrated Freemasonry? The answers to these questions may remain a mystery. But the questions themselves may linger forever. |
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29 Apr 05 - 08:21 AM (#1474150) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: Amos Sheeshe...I would think there are more real issues deserving attention. This tissue of speculation is fit to electrify eleven-year olds, but is about as compelling to me as a Harry Potter life-threatening situation. A |
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29 Apr 05 - 08:28 AM (#1474159) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: Rapparee The Templars were proscribed by a Papal Bull on 22 March 1312. They were founded in 1118. So -- why, after 693 years, should I care one way or the other?? |
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29 Apr 05 - 08:43 AM (#1474171) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: artbrooks The media mostly reported that Joseph Ratzinger grew up in Germany. But in fact he is Bavarian. Did someone move Bavaria? |
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29 Apr 05 - 09:05 AM (#1474190) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: GUEST Tights exemplar |
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29 Apr 05 - 09:29 AM (#1474211) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: *daylia* Hmmm, looks like the Knights Templar are still very much alive and well today. |
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29 Apr 05 - 09:59 AM (#1474224) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: GUEST,freda a more recent papal conspiracy - this one is no fairytale |
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29 Apr 05 - 10:24 AM (#1474236) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: Peace The only thing I find objectionable on this thread is that the original poster, who is probably a regular, has chosen to conceal his/her name. If you believe what you say--and I agree with some of it--then have the decency to face the ridicule you will receive from some folks. A two thousand year flow history is coming together in this time. The world faces what can loosely be described as a Neocan takeover. On that I am with you. Where the Vatican fits in the 'scheme of things'--well, I know it has played a role as has every large financial institution over the years (recall that Newton aside from developing the calculus and laws to do with inertia and motion was also the individual who established the gold standard). Hegel aside, history has not been accidental, IMO. So, KTW, you are not a lone voice here, but when I back a person I like at least to know who it is. Bruce |
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29 Apr 05 - 10:25 AM (#1474237) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: *daylia* Is is just me, or is there's something about that man's eyes that creeps you out too? |
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29 Apr 05 - 10:25 AM (#1474239) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: Rapparee Yes, indeed, Freda, and I think that that one is far more germane than something that happened 693 years ago. |
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29 Apr 05 - 10:33 AM (#1474246) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: freda underhill while the original templars were 693 years ago, i don't discount their being around now in some form or forms - because so much gets handed down over the generations/centuries, both consciously and unconsciously. furthermore, people like to revive "lost", secrets, mystical things. I met a man 30 years ago who dropped large hints about his involvement in the Knights Templar. it was the secretness that made him feel so good, he had to tell. Any organisations which has a philosophy and rituals can make its members feel special, and can create its own circles of power. |
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29 Apr 05 - 10:34 AM (#1474248) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: mg yes. he gives me the willies. something sinister almost. And I have never felt this away about a pope before...I can not believe they elected him over the very outspoken wishes of the fideles. mg |
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29 Apr 05 - 10:35 AM (#1474249) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: Peace Rapaire, Hello. The thigh bone's connected to the hip bone; the hip bone's connected to the back bone. History has been presented as a picture rather than a 'river'. We see chunks as snapshots that presume a serendipitous cause/effect. But please note that when we eat a loaf of bread--which we do in just a few days--that the loaf hsa been through the hands of a grocery clerk, a shipper-receiver, a trucker, a shipper-receiver, a shipper-receiver, a manufacturer, a trucker, a grain handler, a farmer. And we see the loaf of bread. It is the grain however from which the wheat sprouts. And while as economists we can look at the life of the bread, we have to as historians look at the travels of the loaf and all the machinations that preceded its display on a shelf. In the life of the loaf, the three days it is with the person who eats it is a brief time when compared to the total time it took from grain being planted to product being sold in a store. Thus, the 693 years--well, the Chinese have been admired for taking a long view of history as have the samurai, which in Japan has transformed to the leaders in the business world. There are many ways to fight, and many ways to conquer. IMO. BM |
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29 Apr 05 - 11:42 AM (#1474299) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: John Hardly Prince Charles is the Antichrist. Elvis is alive and living above a diner on Beale St. Kennedy was shot by two gunmen. There are actual alien bodies (from outer space, not Mexico) in a holding chamber in Rosswell, NM. Clinton did drug trade from the Mena, AK airport. Paul is dead, Paul is dead, Paul is dead, Paul is dead, Paul is dead, Paul is dead, Paul is dead... ...I am the walrus. koo koo kachoo |
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29 Apr 05 - 12:10 PM (#1474313) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: Peace That doesn't look right to me. You are NOT a walrus, John. |
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29 Apr 05 - 12:19 PM (#1474320) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: GUEST,MMario I can't figure out from the original post whether the autor thinks the Pope is PRO Templer or whether he thinks the Pope is anti-Templer. BTW -it's Roswell isn't it? |
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29 Apr 05 - 12:26 PM (#1474326) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: Dave the Gnome Dan Brown eat yer heart out! The new pope has been investigating the Knights Templar and the Illuminati in Hertford. Keith A - Where are you when we need you??? :D |
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29 Apr 05 - 02:40 PM (#1474439) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: John Hardly "BTW -it's Roswell isn't it?" Spoken as a true insider. [spooky music to fade.....doDOdoDOdoDOdoDO] |
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29 Apr 05 - 02:44 PM (#1474446) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: John Hardly Wasn't Simon Templar "The Saint"? |
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29 Apr 05 - 02:52 PM (#1474455) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: Peace It might be a bunch of balogna, but when one considers that billions of people believe in a God they can't see and are led in their beliefs by leadres they don't know, well, maybe the conspiracy theories that abound are not as off the wall as they seem to be. Thinking there may be aliens in Roswell is no more strange than thinking there is a God who created the universe. We have never seen Him--other than the time He manifested Himself on the Earth about 2,000 years ago. And the book in which He's spoken of has been edited and changed. But THAT makes sense, right? LOL. Gotta love people. |
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29 Apr 05 - 04:43 PM (#1474529) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: Rapparee Gee, Brucie, he called me just last night. We talked on the phone for an hour or so, I guess. Good connection, too -- God sounded like he was right in the room. Oh, he said to tell you "Hi." I'm aware of history as a river, very much so, rather than a series of vignettes with little or no relation to each other. But every river also has a series of backwaters and sloughs. There was a 19th Century "secret society" called the Knights Templars (I believe), which were much like the Masons, the Knights of Pythias, the Odd Fellows, and the K of C. |
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29 Apr 05 - 04:54 PM (#1474536) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: Peace The history of the Templars dates to the time immediately following the death of Jesus. Their extermination in the 1300s (?) (age and memory--sorry) was occasioned at Rennes le Chateau. The story is compelling and strange. It was documented by Baigent, Leigh and Lincoln in "The Holy Blood and the Holy Grail". Their conclusions to do with their 'discoveries' is not something I necessarily agree with, but their scholarship is beyond reproach, IMO, and certainly as it has to do with the Templars. The various theories that are prevalent to do with their influence on the course of events is up for grabs, but for anyone to assume they HAD no influence is not very wise. Interesting too is that the same Baigent who co-authored the HBHG is also editor for the official Masonic publication in England. Not that that has much to do with the price of eggs. BM |
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29 Apr 05 - 05:25 PM (#1474555) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: M.Ted There must be a different version of "The Holy Blood and the Holy Grail" that I haven't read, Brucie, if the scholarship in your book was beyond reproach--the book I read was full of "and if that happened, then this may have happened, and if this, why not something else..". The clincher of course was that in the introduction, the authors said that their book was based on a work of fiction which one of them had found on a rack at the airport. There is a recent book about the Templars(at least it is more recent than HBHG), "Born in Blood", by John J. Robinson, that is based on history and fact, rather than speculation--even with that restriction, it is quite interesting-- As to the post above, if memory serves, the folks in Herefordshire have some empty caves that the Mercury has been trying to fill up with Could-this-have-been's-- |
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29 Apr 05 - 05:30 PM (#1474560) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: John Hardly These huge conspiracies always start out small and innocent enough. In this case just two entrepreneurial brothers, Al and Lou Manoti, working out of a disused chicken barn on the family property. By hand (and hammer) they were fashioning what would come to be known as "bobble-heads" out of (then) precious aluminum. They caught on quickly. Soon everyone wanted one for the dashboard of their coaches. And everyone had one. Even the first president of the United States of American, John Hanson. Business was booming. They named the little contraptions "Aluminum Noddies" but that soon got shortened to "Aluminoddies". Well, Al had a son and named him Lou, and likewise, Lou had a son and named him Al. This started a tradition still going on today so that there has always been an Al and a Lou Manoti. But bad times befell their industry. The industrial age allowed the masses to acquire Aluminoddies -- slip-shod mass-produced ghosts of the formerly grand hand-hammered originals. They couldn't keep the once booming business going. They fell to the dark side. By the turn of the 20th century the family business had shifted to a string of seedy strip-club/burlesque houses call Looming Naughties. This is all true. I swear it on my father's masonic ring. |
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29 Apr 05 - 05:49 PM (#1474563) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: Peace M Ted--the section of the book I was making reference to had to do with the extermination of the Templars. Go back and check it. And please read a bit more closely next time. |
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29 Apr 05 - 06:08 PM (#1474577) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: Peace The post I mad, M Ted, stated that the Templar part of the history is accurate. That is, it jives with other accounts that are not speculative. To repeat, I do not necessarily agree with the conclusions the trio arrived at. But after Rennes le Chateau, the Templars disappear quite quickly from the historical stage. That is fact. The economic influence they had is well documented, and that is where I was coming from. To end, I have no idea which book you read. You are more than entitled to disagree with anything you want, because there are none of us who can provide evidence that is absolute. Just considered opinions. |
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29 Apr 05 - 06:32 PM (#1474593) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: Peace PS There are many people here who have lots to say about the Templars. Undoubtedly based on history and their reading. FYI, the Templars began in the early 1100s, not at the time of Christ as I stated above. Though by now that someone would have caught that. |
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29 Apr 05 - 07:17 PM (#1474614) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: Rapparee The Templars were orginally an order of knights founded in 1118 and approved by (I think it was) Baldwin II; they were to defend the Temple in Jerusalem. At that time they were a mendicant order and enforced the "poverty-chastity-obedience" rule. Over the next couple hundred years, the order became more and more powerful, mostly by the simple fact that various Popes and Kings exempted them from taxes and tithes because of the "Temple at Jerusalem" connection. One of the Phillips (of France) needed money, and decided that the Templars (who by that time were sort of the "bankers of Europe") had it. He began an investigation of the Order, and even convinced the Pope to issue a Bull against the order (which was done on March 22, 1312). With that, the Order had a full-blown persecution. They were accused of the usual sexual "depravities" and of worshiping the idol/demon Baphomet. Most of them were tortured and burned; some apparently did escape to England; all of the property and money the Church and the governments could get their hands on was comfiscated. England, as I remember it, took what money the order still had and turned at least some of the Order over to the continental Church. Up until about 1908, the criticisms against the Templars were pretty much taken as proven fact by scholars. Since that time, however, it's thought that the Order was more sinned against than sinning. The above is from memory. I simply don't subscribe to a conspiracy theory about the Templars; there are too many other, more provable, things out there today. |
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29 Apr 05 - 09:19 PM (#1474665) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: GUEST,Yet Another Guest Pardon me for butting in,chaps.Brucie-you mentioned Neocans earlier.Does this mean we now have to contend with crypto-Canadians along with everything else? Incidentally,Rapaire I'm not sure about the KofC but I can confirm the existence of a KFC in Hertford(pron."Hartford")if that helps.Cheers G. |
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29 Apr 05 - 10:25 PM (#1474694) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: Ebbie John Hardly, fascinating. When they're sold in the UK, are those bobble-heads known by a different name? |
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29 Apr 05 - 10:35 PM (#1474703) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: artbrooks What Rapaire said is basically what I recall from late Medieval history. The politicians of the time, otherwise known as the kings, princes, etc., were well known for paying off their debts by execution of those who were dumb enough to loan them money and then confiscating whatever was left over. Henry VIII (of England) did much the same when he had his "religious" revelation and expelled the Catholic clergy and confiscated much of the property of the Church. |
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29 Apr 05 - 11:15 PM (#1474719) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: wysiwyg Anyone who thinks cardinals of the church could agree on a conspiracy plan doesn't understand the first thing about church life! To protect their "power" and authority? Naw-- every one of them knows their power lies in using their vote in conclave THEIR way-- every one of them an individual with a platform-- not as suggested by a non-yet-made poobah! ~S~ |
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29 Apr 05 - 11:23 PM (#1474725) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: robomatic Sounds like a natural for Dan Brown's next magnum opus. That or a South Park plot. |
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30 Apr 05 - 12:55 AM (#1474756) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: Peace "Brucie-you mentioned Neocans earlier.Does this mean we now have to contend with crypto-Canadians along with everything else?' I have no idea what you--representing the we you mention--have to contend with. However, YOU might begin by contending with your identity crisis. |
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30 Apr 05 - 03:15 AM (#1474805) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: Les in Chorlton Is it true that Ian Pasley, Moderator of the Presbyterian church in Ulster, is not his real, given or birth name? |
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30 Apr 05 - 06:42 AM (#1474862) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: John Hardly Ebbie, I wish I knew. Alas, I don't speak British. Cheers, John 'ardly |
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30 Apr 05 - 03:09 PM (#1475139) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: dianavan Oh the secrets of the middle ages... Looks like we are still intrigued, and why not? The dark ages are called that for a reason. Were the Knights good or bad? Originally, they were warriors but were tamed in the courts of Eleanor of Aquitaine. They were informed by Cathars of the true story of Christ. They were caught in the middle of a struggle for power between the Pope and the Monarchy. Seems to me that they would have had to go underground for survival. Are they surviving in the Vatican or in the secret societies of the Neo Cons? Are they a secret society separate from both? Do they exist at all except in our imagination? They are definitely a part of our history and legends (including King Arthur) abound. I am fascinated but will never know the truth. I have accepted this. The original post is contradictory. Is the new Pope a Templar or an inquisitor? Benedictines (his order) are probably closer to the truth about the life of Christ than anyone else. Of course, it will remain a secret for the sake of the church. I doubt if he is a Templar but he has probably studied them at great length. He is a man of many secrets. |
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30 Apr 05 - 06:32 PM (#1475278) Subject: RE: BS: The Templar Pope Conspiracy From: Peace '"Since I entered politics, I have chiefly had men's views confided to me privately. Some of the biggest men in the United States, in the Field of commerce and manufacture, are afraid of something. They know that there is a power somewhere -- so organized, so subtle, so watchful, so interlocked, so complete, so pervasive -- that they better not speak above their breath when they speak in condemnation of it." - Woodrow Wilson, The New Freedom, 1913' |