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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Big Mick Date: 30 Oct 03 - 11:32 PM Jim, I sang your wonderful song during my miniconcert at the recent FSGW Getaway weekend. You should have heard the voices of the gathered folkies singing the chorus back at me.....very powerful, with wonderful harmonies. The kind of moment that singers live for. I have loved this song from the first time I heard it. Congratulations, once again, on a wonderful tellin'. All the best, Mick Lane |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim McLean Date: 31 Oct 03 - 04:49 AM Thanks everyone. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: GUEST Date: 22 Nov 04 - 08:57 AM The song is a translation of a Gaelic song, in the English it is called Hush Hush Inessier, (not sure of the English spelling for Inisheer. The music is an ancient piping tune, known to many, again in the English tongue as Mist Covered Mountains. Hush Hush Ineseer can be heard on ScotRadio, by the group North Sea Gas and is available from the same group at www.nsg.com or from Greentrax records at www.greentrax.com Hope that helps. Dave Scottish Nationalist Television TV SCOTS/ScotRadio Bringing Scotland to the world TV SCOTS http://www.electricscotland.com/tvscots/index.htm |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: MMario Date: 22 Nov 04 - 09:02 AM Jim - do you ever feel like you keep talking, and talking and no one is listening? |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim McLean Date: 30 Dec 04 - 05:09 AM Hi Mario, I've just read this latest posting and couldn't agree with you more more! I haven't heard the Gaelic version by North Sea Gas but I can assure everyone that my words are original and most probably the Gaelic version is a translation from my English. I wrote it around 1963 and it was first published in book form in 1968. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Sabine Date: 30 Dec 04 - 08:23 AM Think the biggest problem is that other people don't read but just write.... regards Sabine |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: George Seto - af221@chebucto.ns.ca Date: 31 Dec 04 - 02:54 PM Either that, Jim, or someone is singing Chì Mi Na Mórbheanna, and this fellow thinks that because it's the same tune, it's your song in Gaelic. Oh well.... |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 31 Dec 04 - 05:24 PM People like that always want there to be an "ancient Gaelic original," and it's no use telling them when they're talking rubbish. That kind of ignorance is invincible. I wrote a crushing little reply at the time, but didn't post it. Chi mi na Mòr-bheanna was written (as Dùil ri Baile Chaolais fhaicinn) by John Cameron of Ballachulish (c.1856). The tune wasn't originally Gaelic; nor is it "ancient." It's an adaptation of Johnny's so long at the Fair, which itself probably isn't older than the second half of the 18th century, and may not even be Scottish. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: ranger1 Date: 25 May 05 - 08:05 PM I have the NSG CD with this song on it (Spirit of Scotland). It's sung in English with no mention of ever having been in Gaelic. It is, however, listed as Trad. They've tweaked the lyrics a bit, but there's no doubt it's the same song. I'm happy to know where it really came from, it's a beautiful, haunting song that I fell in love with the first time I heard it. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: GUEST Date: 26 May 05 - 01:40 AM Is is possible to get the basic chords for this song? Much appreicated! -Lenie "Is it not strange that sheeps guts should hail sould from men's bodies?" -William Shakspeare 'Much ado about nothing.' |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim McLean Date: 26 May 05 - 04:38 AM Once again can I point out that I wrote Hush, Hush etc AKA Smile in your Sleep. It is not Trad and is registered with the MCPS and PRS, Published by Duart Music. As Malcolm points out the tune is basically chi mi na morbheanna although the tune to that song is really only similar to that used for my chorus. My verse melody is entirely different, more akin to the pipe tune Mist covered Mountains of Home. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: PoohBear Date: 26 May 05 - 10:24 AM Serendipity! I was listening to a recording of The Corries on my way to work this morning and heard this song. . . one of my favorites of this particular LP. Thanks for a beautiful - and thought provoking - set of lyrics, Jim. Cheers PB |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Moleskin Joe Date: 26 May 05 - 10:53 AM Hi Can anyone confirm that the jig Mist Covered Mountain/Mist on the Mountain by Junior Crehan is the same tune? I am sure I heard somewhere that he made the jig, which is pretty well known, out of the tune. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: GUEST Date: 16 May 07 - 11:38 AM r u still looking for the chords to the song hush hush (smile in your sleep bonnie baby?? if so i have them |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jack Campin Date: 16 May 07 - 02:46 PM The chords are in the GIF score that was linked to here. Junior Crehan's tune has no resemblance to the Scottish one that I can see. I find Jim's great song a bit of a liability in mixed vocal/instrumental sessions. I like playing the pipe tune version. It's got the same notes but the repeat structure is different. So when I try to start the tune, it gets hijacked by singers and I can't continue what I started - I'd prefer to move on to a faster piece after doing the tune in its straight AABB form once or twice, instead everybody goes AB AB AB AB. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim McLean Date: 17 May 07 - 06:42 AM Jack, I wrote the song to the pipe tune (basically) with the chorus being the first part. As a song it works as ABAB etc. but I know what you mean as an intrumental as I was a piper. The traditional Mist Covered Mountains song is slightly different in the first part and the second part is entirely different although some people continue to link Chi Mi.. to Mist Covered Mountains (the pipe tune). |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: GUEST,NS Date: 22 May 07 - 06:26 PM Hey ew to this but just happened by this site. Just wanted to say that i have heard it with the lines in verse 3 as follows: Where was our proud highland mettle, That once stood sae fearless in battle, Stand cowed, thered like cattle, And wait to be shipped o'er the ocean. It has a bit more of a Scottish twang to it too! Just thought you'd like to know! |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jack Campin Date: 22 May 07 - 06:47 PM "Thered"? As in hered and everywhered? |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: GUEST,George Date: 23 May 07 - 12:03 PM Guest,NS hasn't been reading this thread as Jim McLean already posted this verse, albeit correctly. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: GUEST Date: 23 May 07 - 12:25 PM GUEST,NS, Jim McLean is the author of this marvelous story/song. You should read the whole thread. You will not be sorry that you did. All the best, Mick |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: GUEST,me Date: 05 Dec 08 - 12:47 PM Ross Noble claims some writers are coruscating in their condemnation of the Clearances, seeing the process as an early version of "ethnic cleansing". However, Noble believes this approach over-simplifies the issues involved. Under the economic and social ideas of the several centuries involved, landowners and employers were generally callous about the "lower orders", (exemplified by the 1843 fictional character of Ebenezer Scrooge) and these modern terms such as "genocide" and "ethnic cleansing" reflect new sensitivities and social perspectives, which in this case would not apply, as most of the landlords were fellow Scotsmen. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: GUEST,Alba Nuadh Date: 18 Sep 09 - 01:00 PM So Jim,where are all the verses? We sing it locally are there are some you are missing. |
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Subject: DT Corr: Smile In Your Sleep (Hush, Hush) (McLean) From: Jim McLean Date: 18 Sep 09 - 07:32 PM This is from Joe Offer's posting of October 2003 (with a slight correction).
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim McLean Date: 18 Sep 09 - 07:34 PM PS Alba Nuadh, those are all the verses I wrote. Cheers, Jim |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: GUEST,Alyce Date: 27 Oct 09 - 05:10 PM I remember my grade three teacher, and now close friend, Sine McKenna taught us this song as part of our first music lesson. It has always stayed with me- its such a powerful song. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: GUEST,mulv Date: 19 Feb 10 - 04:19 PM Fabulous air and lyrics,which I've sung for many years now.I still feel very proud and enriched by bragging that I first heard Barbara Dickson singing this very song (with guitar)in our local Malvern folk club in either late '72 or early '73 and should still have the original taped recording somewhere in the house.This was,of course,when she were a 'proper folkie' (though she didn't have a beard !).She used lots of excellent material back then (e.g. Archie Fisher's 'Shipyard Apprentice')and was clearly destined. Just wondering - if Jim gets to read this - about the air for 3rd verse.Difficult to explain (since,though I can sing,I'm no musician)-but BD sang a slightly different air to the first two lines of that verse (than to any of the other verses) which,to fit the air/music scanned/sang as Where was our proud Highland mettle o' men, All once so famed in battle etc (back to the same tune as other verses) The tune change was also included in part of the original pipe tune.And the change just broke up the song to give it an extra 'lift' and catch the listener's attention even more.Has Jim or anybody else heard it sung in that sort of manner ? Or is that commonplace ? Thanks for any help - and thanks to Jim for writing it in the first place.Of course,if Barbara Dickson IS reading this,she's quite welcome to comment !! |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim McLean Date: 19 Feb 10 - 05:26 PM I haven't heard Barbara's version but I've noticed some singers confuse my version of the tune with Chi Mi na Morbheana. I use, basically, the the pipe tune Mist Covered Mountains where the verse is different to the chorus and I have changed the melody occasionally to suit the mood of the words. The first recording of the song was in the mid sixties but I remember seeing Barbara Dixon in the Troubadour, London, about 1963/64 in the company of Anne Briggs when we all ran about together. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: GUEST,Betsy Date: 19 Feb 10 - 08:04 PM Jim thanks for putting up with the great disection of your wonderful song. I read all the words ,but still, there was a part (I'm sure sang by Barbara Dickson) that went ......"Where are the men we call heroes". It may well be my shitty memory or perhaps she alter or add a verse to a part of the song. Nice to talk about a great song and thanks for adding all the backround . Cheers Betsy |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim McLean Date: 20 Feb 10 - 09:14 AM There is a version by the Fureys which pretty well mangles the song with sleeve notes saying "....English soldiers burnt down the houses while Irish defenders huddled like cattle ...". The song is about the Scottish Highland Clearances and the victims were abused by their own people, Scottish factors for Highland lairds. The Duke of Sutherland, one of the worst 'Clearers' however was an Englishmen. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: GUEST,mulv Date: 21 Feb 10 - 12:24 PM Might better explain what I meant about BD's singing of the song by reffering to http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TTdb6sEl0gI&feature=related part of Mark Knoeffler show,amazingly.The first set is the Mist Covered Mountains - let's call it in 4 phases,A,B,C,A A is exactly as the chorus was sung B is exactly as verses 1,2 & 4 were sung C is almost exactly how I recall verse 3 being sung only all substantially faster than the youtube clip. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim Carroll Date: 22 Feb 10 - 04:10 AM "Junior Crehan's tune has no resemblance to the Scottish one that I can see." Junior's 'Mist Covered Mountain' is almost identical to 'Mist Covered Mountains of Home' but in jig time, although he said was never aware of the similarities. Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jack Campin Date: 22 Feb 10 - 06:26 AM Almost identical?
The strongest I'd put it is that Crehan's tune might be vaguely inspired by the Scottish one. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim McLean Date: 22 Feb 10 - 07:15 AM Mulv, I can't play the YouTube version for some reason, but I will keep trying. The following is almost exactly the tune I use, the first part being the chorus and the second obviously the verse. X:323 T:Mist Covered Mountains, The L:1/8 M:6/8 K:Am A3 A3|e2 e e>dB|G3 G3|B>AB A>GA| c3 d3|e>fg B>AG|A>Be d>cB|A3 A3:| e3 e3|d>eg e>dB|G2 G d2 B|e2 e d>cB| A3 c3|d>eg B>AG|A>Be d>cB|A3 A3:| (only the F is sharp) This is almost the same as Jack's second tune, Mist Covered Mountains, as played as a pipe tune and is not the same as Chi Mi na Morbheanna as is sometimes claimed, the second part of the tune being different. I can only see a VERY vague resemblance to The Mist on the Mountains but would not say they are remotely similar under any form of scrutiny. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim McLean Date: 22 Feb 10 - 07:46 AM Mulv, I have listened to Mark Knopfler's version. He plays a,a,b but interestingly enough the first line of 'a' is actually of Chi Mi Na Morbheana while 'b' is The Mist Covered Mountains of Home, pipe version. The tune I use can be heard here, sung by Wendy Arrowsmith. She sings a few different lyrics but the melody is what I used. Wndy |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim Carroll Date: 22 Feb 10 - 12:26 PM "Almost identical?" Jack, Sorry; I don't read music, but I have heard Junior play it on many occasions, even have several recordings of him doing so. I have have also heard the song. It sounds the same to me, but we might be talking about different songs. Junior made the tune without being aware of having heard the song; but when the similarities were pointed out to a member of his family (a musician herself), she accepted totally that it was the same in different times. Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim McLean Date: 22 Feb 10 - 01:43 PM Jim, If you listen to Wendy Arrowsmith on the YouTube link I posted then listen to this and no matter how you vary the speed, the tunes are not the same. Mist on the Mountain and the title of Junior Crehan's tune is 'The Mist on the Mountain' not as you posted 'Mist Covered Mountain' |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jack Campin Date: 22 Feb 10 - 01:47 PM Maybe what Jim knows as the (Irish?) song "The Mist Covered Mountains of Home" has a different tune to the Scottish "Mist Covered Mountains"? You don't need to read music to use ABC. Copy one of the ABC tunes (everything from the "X:" line to the end), paste it into the box at http://www.folkinfo.org/songs/abcconvert.php , and hit the "Submit" button. You will get the box filled with staff notation: click in it and you can hear a MIDI of the tune. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim Carroll Date: 22 Feb 10 - 08:52 PM "Mist Covered Mountain" The title of Junior's tune is 'The Mist Covered Mountain'; that is what he called it when he first gave it to us back in the 70s and it was published under that title in the collection edited by his daughter Angela Crotty, released after his death (Martin Junior Crehan; Musical compostions and memories 1908-1998 - page 11). I have it in front of me as I type It refers to Mount Callan, which we can see from our back window - Junior lived about three miles from here and we recorded many songs stories, tunes and a great deal of lore from him over the last 30 odd years. Thanks for the tips for listening to the tune and for reading the ABC Jack and Jim - I'm having sound problems at present, but will listen to it when I get them sorted. The song I know as 'Mist Covered Mountains of Home' is the Scots one, I'm pretty sure it was recorded by Jimmy Shand; may be wrong on this, but I knew it long before I met Junior. I am happy to let anybody have a recording of Junior playing the tune. Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim McLean Date: 23 Feb 10 - 05:32 AM Sorry Jim, there seems to be many titles for Junior Crehan's song. This from Irishinfo titles I think we are discussing three melodies here: 1. Chi mi na Mòr-bheanna was written (as Dùil ri Baile Chaolais fhaicinn) by John Cameron of Ballachulish (c.1856). The tune wasn't originally Gaelic; nor is it "ancient." It's an adaptation of Johnny's so long at the Fair, which itself probably isn't older than the second half of the 18th century, and may not even be Scottish.(copied from a previous post by Malcolm Douglas) 2. Mist covered Mountains of Home; a pipe version of Chi mi but differs on various main parts of the melody, used by me. 3. Junior Crehan's melody in jig time which has various titles but is definitely not the same as either of the two above. I agree with Jack that 'The strongest I'd put it is that Crehan's tune might be vaguely inspired by the Scottish one'. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim Carroll Date: 23 Feb 10 - 08:24 AM All, Just in case I was losing the plot I dragged out Junior's double CD 'The Last House in Ballymackea' where the tune appears on CD 2 as 'The Mist Covered Mountain', paired with 'Scully Casey's Jig' - again, I have no doubt that the two tunes are related. However, I am not a musician and don't read music, so I must bow to those with greater knowledge and experience than mine. I have done some work on tune comparisons related to research on the origins of the tunes MacColl adapted for his own songs, but that was somewhat limited. Having said which, I just bumped into one of the directors of a traditional music school who pointed out that locally, the two tunes are accepted as being from the one source to the extent that they are paired in local sessions, the song air then the jig. He also pointed out that the comparison of the two is given as an example in an academic dissertation on the influence of Scots music on the Irish tradition (be happy to share the details off-line). I don't know if piper Peter Laban is observing this - I would very much value his input. Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: GUEST Date: 23 Feb 10 - 08:32 AM Having said which, I just bumped into one of the directors of a traditional music school who pointed out that locally, the two tunes are accepted as being from the one source to the extent that they are paired in local sessions, the song air then the jig. The same thing happens with the song and jig "The Lark in the Morning", which are also totally different tunes. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim McLean Date: 23 Feb 10 - 04:18 PM Jim, the time scale seems to be: Chi Mi Na Morbheanns 1856. Mist Covered Mountains of Home; Scots Guards Settings 1954. Smile in your Sleep 1963 (my song using the Scots Guards settings .. almost). Junior Crehan's tune First recording 1976 (according to Irishinfo). If you listen to Junior's jig with Mist Covered Mountains in mind you could be forgiven if you associate the two but it's a case of Junior playing within the 'contour' of Mist Covered Mountains of Home, and only a few bars, set in jig time, although the chord structure is not followed and one would have to insert starting places etc., hence he has created a new tune. But no one,unless his ears are painted on, can say Junior's jig and Mist Covered Mountains of Home are the same melody. Also to say that both tunes are accepted as being from the one source would assume another original tune, the source for both which is not the case. I remember Matt McGinn asking me to write a song with him. Matt's idea was to take a well known tune say, the Highland Fairy Lullaby, and from that create Coorie Doon. I didn't co-operate but one can see that he created a different tune albeit from an established melody, THE source. I would be interested to hear off line any comments regarding 'academic dissertation on the influence of Scots music on the Irish tradition' as you know this interests me. One point, which melody does your friend associate with the 'song air'? Chi MI or Mist Covered Mountains as they are not the same although often confused. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jack Campin Date: 23 Feb 10 - 04:54 PM "Chi mi na mor-bheanna" was not published at first with a notated tune, as far as I know - the earliest source for it I've seen (a book of Gaelic poems from about 1880) said to use "Johnny's too long at the fair". Since then the tune has evolved - probably the one we're most familiar with first saw print in a Mod sheet a bit before 1900, it's in the 1896-1912 volume of "Coisir a Mhoid". Anne Lorne Gillies, in "Songs of Gaelic Scotland", adds to the confusion by printing a version of the tune which mixes up the Mod's one and the pipe version - at least she has the decency to say what she's doing. The least documented change is whatever happened between "Johnny's too long at the fair" around 1856 and the Mod's tune forty years later. They are more closely related than either is to Junior Crehan's jig, but nobody could confuse the two. The Mod book credits the arrangement to John Bell but doesn't say he wrote the tune itself. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Seamus Kennedy Date: 23 Feb 10 - 05:17 PM And not to demean the thread, but Johnny's So Long At the Fair is the melody (or variant thereof) of the Seven Old Ladies. This sort of thing goes on a lot e.g. Fáinne Geal an Lae = the Dawning of the Day = Raglan Road. Up the tempo a bit and you have William Bloat. The jig Donnybrook Fair slowed down to an air gives us Easy and Slow. Anyway, great song Jim! |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jack Campin Date: 23 Feb 10 - 06:33 PM Seven Old Ladies? There are only three in Britain. Are Irish lavatories a lot bigger? |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim Carroll Date: 23 Feb 10 - 07:57 PM Can I make something clear - I am in no way implying that Junior plagerised the song - he was one of the most frankly honest people I ever met and would never do such a thing. We recorded Ewan MacColl in the early eighties and asked him how he approached his songwriting. He said that when you were involved in song and music, after a while you subconciously remembered and mentally filed everything you heard. When you came to make a new tune you drew from what you already knew and produced something different but identifiably yours. Junior, who was totally absorbed in his music, which was as much a part of his life as drawing breath, fits this description perfectly and I am convinced that any similarities to the song were totally due to this. This, I think, fits in with what Jim and Jack said. Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jack Campin Date: 24 Feb 10 - 09:04 AM Here for comparison is the "official" version of "Chi mi na mor-bheanna":
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim McLean Date: 24 Feb 10 - 10:39 AM Thanks for that, Jack. The Rankin family sing Chi Mi'correctly' to my ear. You can hear the difference in the first two bars and in the first line of the chorus as to that of the pipe tune Mist Covered, which is the setting I use. I chose the pipe version because I felt it suited my verse to go up high when making an appeal rather than stay on the same not as in Chi Mi. Rakin Family |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: Jim McLean Date: 24 Feb 10 - 10:43 AM Sorry the clicky should have read Rankin Family. By the way there are other versions of Chi Mi on Youtube which don't use the 'official' version of the tune but mix it up with the pipe version, especially for part b, which I call the verse. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Hush, hush time to be sleeping From: GUEST,mulv Date: 28 Feb 10 - 08:10 PM Thanks for the clarification,Jim (Mc) To clarify,Wendy's verses are as BD's THIRD VERSE (only)- clearly BD 'alternated' the airs between the two mentioned,so to speak.Also,Wendy's chorus is not as BD sang,either.Anyways,my original question has been answered,thanks very much.When I do sing this,I will stick with the BD version since it is what I *know* (got very used to this version after 35+ years !!) - but will of course acknowledge the lyrics.Hope that causes no offence to anybody and my curiosity has been well explained.But I know that the 'mixed' BD version works well. Thanks to all who contributed - especially Jim for taking so much time to follow all this up personally. |
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