///"Without god we couldn't know right from wrong," Which god?/// The refutation is quite a bit simpler: First, ask the person if morality originates from god. If the answer is yes (as it virtually always is) then we can conclude then that morality is whatever god says it is since it originates from "him." If this is the case then god can tell you to kill people, to cheat people, to molest little children, etc. because "he" now has decided that this is moral behavior instead of that loving thy neighbor stuff. So then, would you go out and start killing, cheating and molesting people because god now says that this is moral? No, you wouldn't. So does morality emanate or originate from god? No. God has to follow the same moral standard that we humans do in order to be recognized as moral by humans. Anything less, is not moral. Therefore since god has to follow the same moral standard we do to be considered moral then we would indeed know right from wrong without god. Now, should the person answer no--morality does not originate from god--then they've generously cut out all that philosophizing and have admitted up front then that we would know morality without god because it does not originate from "him."
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