Yeah but I move in mysterious ways Michael. My Morris comparison still holds.

I would have replied earlier but was watching the England match in the pub and the celebrations carried on. A bit of a bugger as it is now 6.00am and I am waiting for my toast to burn before being picked up to go and deliver my sermon from the pulpit. (Speaking of future NHS structures at a conference is similar to speaking of the distant past in a church. Hope the congregation have a salt pot in their collective pocket.

To both Joe and yourself I say this. You are both unduly complicating the issue. On the few occasions I have been in a service I have listened to the words. I don't think that is asking too much. If the words are being used, it isn't a mental leap too far to expect them to be bound up in the belief people profess.

So... When I am sat across from a doctor saying amen to fantasy such as rising from the dead, performing of miracles or a being sentient enough to hear such prayer. .. I wonder how that doctor can explain how the rising from the dead works.

They can't.

They don't have to.

They traditionally rather than fundamentally believe.

Anyone can traditionally believe. Even for the hour or so it takes to knock out a weddingor funeral. I did a reading at a funeral. Does that make it any less real to those listening who had belief? No. It didn't.

What is the bloody difference? I recall the "we are all God's children" bit. So it makes the prerequisite to believe a little superfluous doesn't it?