The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #65500   Message #1079923
Posted By: Malcolm Douglas
25-Dec-03 - 08:04 PM
Thread Name: Origins: Some Rival Has Stolen My True Love Away
Subject: Lyr Add: MY TRUE LOVE I'VE LOST
As so often, Alfred Williams was guessing in the dark, though his idea that the song belonged to the 18th century might perhaps suggest that the tune he heard was similar to the one Lucy Broadwood published. "Rifles" is almost certainly a corruption of "Rival". The set including the "myrtle tree" verse (another floater) will, I expect, be the one that Percy Grainger found at Wimbledon; the singer, Alfred Hunt, was from Kirdford in West Sussex.


Here is the song as Henry Hills sang it:


MY TRUE LOVE I'VE LOST

(From Henry Hills, late of Lodsworth, Sussex. Noted by W Percy Merrick at Shepperton, Middlesex, November 1899)

My true love I've lost, and I cannot her find,
For who knows, for who knows that she mayn't change her mind?
I'll go and search some shady grove by night and by day,
For to find, for to find, for to find,
For to find out my own true love, the girl that I love best.

And when I have found out my joy and heart's delight,
I'll comfort her more kinder by day and by night;
It's I will prove more constant than any turtle-dove
Unto her, unto her, unto her,
Unto her like some lover I always will prove true.

Here's Venus and Volum, they were both as one,
So keep yourself single as you and I have done;
So keep yourself single, so constant I'll retire
Unto her, unto her, unto her,
Unto her like some Venus that flourishes like fire.

We'll make the bugle speak, and the serpent shall sing,
here's instruments of music for to make those valleys ring;
The huntsman he shall holloa, and the hounds shall make a noise,
For to fill, for to fill, for to fill,
To fill my love's heart with ten thousand of bright joys.


Journal of the Folk Song Society, I (3) 1901, 96.


X:1
T:My True Love I've Lost
S:Henry Hills, late of Lodsworth, Sussex. November 1899.
Z:W Percy Merrick.
B:Journal of the Folk Song Society, I (3) 1901, 96
N:Tune is a White Cockade variant
L:1/8
Q:1/4=100
M:4/4
K:C
"Allegretto"
C2|(C2 E2) G2 G2|(G2 F2) D2 F2|(E2C2) D2 (DB,)|C6 C2|
w:My true_ love I've lost,_ and I can-*not her_ find, For
(C2 E2) G2 G2|(G2 E2) F2 G2|A2 G2 F2 A2|G6 C2|C2 E2 G2 G2|
w:who_ knows, for who_ knows that she mayn't change her mind? I'll go and search some
G2 E2 F2 G2|(A2 G2) E2 C2|(D2E2) (FG) A2|HG4 (G,A,) B,2|C4 F2 G2|
w:sha-dy grove by night_ and by day,_ For_ to find, for_ to find, for to
A4 D3 C|(C2 G2) G2 G2|G2 E2 E2 G2|F3 D E2 E2|C6|]
w:find, For to find_ out my own true love, the girl that I love best.


The tune is a variant of The White Cockade. Cecil Sharp also found examples of the song in much the same form. Volum was glossed as "probably = Vulcan", but it appears that Venus and Volum was actually a mis-hearing of Phœnix and female, as the following broadside example shows:


PHŒNIX AND FEMALE

My true love is lost, and I cannot her find,
Who knows and who knows but she may change her mind,
But I'll go and search the groves by night and by day,
For to find out my true love that never would obey.

And when I do find out my own heart's delight,
I'll comfort her kindly by day and by night
And prove more constant than the turtle dove,
Nor ever prove false to the girl that I love.

The horn it shall sound and the serpent shall sting,
The melodies of music shall make the groves to ring;
The huntsman shall hollo, and the hounds make a noise,
To fill my loves heart with ten thousand sweet joys.

The Phœnix and Female they being both as one
She keeps herself single by living alone,
Be not dearest dear so chaste and so retire,
Left like a Phœnix you perish in the fire.

My heart it is uneasy I can take no rest,
For thinking of the pretty girl that I love best,
For thinking of the pretty girl distresses my mind,
Unto her like some turtle dove will never prove unkind.


Printed and sold by J Pitts, No 14, Great St Andrew Street, Seven Dials. [Between 1802 and 1819]. Bodleian Library, Harding B 16(203c). At the Bodleian Library: Phœnix and Female.


There are echoes in this broadside of Lawrence Price's song, though whether there was any direct influence I wouldn't like to guess. Other forms of Some Rival found in tradition are also a mix of material apparently conflated from Price, whether mediated through the Pitts broadside or another (I think that it was also issued by other printers) or through some other interim source, and of common floating verses.

The forms we have from oral currency fall into two tune groups: those noted by W Percy Merrick (Sussex) and by Cecil Sharp in Oxfordshire and Somerset are sung in 4/4 to a White Cockade variant, with repeated phrases as commonly found with that song; while those noted by Percy Grainger (Surrey), George Butterworth (Sussex), Lucy Broadwood (Surrey and Sussex) and Sharp (Sussex) are sung in 3/4 to variants of a quite different tune which I can't place at the moment, though I'm a little reminded of The Ploughshare (in the DT as The Seasons Round) as the Copper family sing it. The song was also found by Alfred Williams (Wiltshire: no tune noted) and by the Hammond Brothers (Hampshire: tune noted but unpublished). Neither tune group bears any obvious resemblance to Fair Angel of England:


X:1
T:Bonny Sweet Robin
T:Fair Angel of England
B:Simpson, The British Broadside Ballad and Its Music, 1966, 60.
N:From 1628 virginal arrangement in BM MS Add. 23623, fol. 13v, where it appears as "Bonni well Robin van Doctr. Jan Bull".
N:Original contains varied repeat of each strain.
L:1/8
Q:1/4=100
M:3/4
K:C
D2|:F3 G F2|E3 F D2|c3 A d2|A4:|
|:A2 d2 c2|B3 A G2|c3 B A2|F3 E D2|
c3 B AG|FEFG A2|G2 E4|D6:|]