The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #73222   Message #1268721
Posted By: M.Ted
10-Sep-04 - 02:42 PM
Thread Name: BS: Is there a god or not?
Subject: RE: BS: Is there a god or not?
Actually, Gervase, STA did offer that, and four other arguements, as proof-- and he did say "Therefore there is something intelligent by which all natural things are arranged in accordance with a plan---and this we call God."

You see order in the Universe, the various and sundry laws of science, the only reason that you don't see it as the hand of God is very simply that you prefer to call it something else--STA called it God, long before you decided that it was something else--you of course, are more than welcome to provide another definition of God, or may, simply may want to clarify what it is that you don't believe in-

Your comment that "a tetradhedron makes best use of the bonds of the carbon atom" presumes the existance of other possibilities, and they way that you use the word "best" implies that there is a higher value that has been imposed--

The Acquinian proof opened the doors to science because it presented the idea that there was an order to the universe that was logical, and therefore, knowable--this is a tenet which is implicit in the pursuit of science--



dunkel esel: You said" St. Aquina's theory is all very well, but it has one main flaw... it assumes that the world does have order and a clear design. It doesn't. Natural disasters aren't orderly, neither is cancer. "

Scientific examination shows that both natural disasters and cancer do have an order to them--but it doesn't make them easier to deal with--we are born, we live, and we die--a clear design, and one that repeats itself without exception--(unless you believe that Christ was the one exception, but in that case, you wouldn't be inclined to refute STA)--