weelittledrummer said: "Faith in God is literally believing the impossible" and that of course means it is impossible rationally to argue against it. Neat. But I've often wondered about the disciple Thomas: would he be classed as a believer, or non-believer? He did believe the impossible, but only after seeing the physical proof of it (allegedly).

Joe, I understand your point about 1960. I suppose it's analagous with the unease I feel about a campaign in the UK to pardon 300 or so soldiers executed (without any proper hearings) for supposed cowardice during WW1. Descendents deserve to have the stygma lifted, but the standards of the day were applied, however criminally wrong they were. Maybe it is enough to learn from the past without having to rewrite it.

Your position on gay marriage makes sense, up to a point. But it embraces the knowing perpetuation of an injustice, just to avoid a church tearing itself apart. I can't buy that.