"It is the job of the socialist to state that socialist society is possible and provide an organisational basis to make it happen rather than to run a socialist society - that is the job of people, pragmatism can wait until it happens"

well, piers, you obviously see it that way. I see your "theoretical" approach as avoidance. It is in the pragmatics that socialism breaks down. To assert that it just seems that way, so let's try it anyway and see what happens, isn't naive -- it's disatisfaction with the way things are (probably because you see inequity or feel slighted) and saying that anything would be better. And it avoids economic realities and realities of human nature that, rather than "are decided by an economic system", decide how economic systems evolve.

You're entitled. I just think you're wrong (and I assume you think the same of me).

Have a nice day!