The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #77798 Message #1391694
Posted By: Stilly River Sage
28-Jan-05 - 05:34 PM
Thread Name: What are jubal hounds?
Subject: RE: What are jubal hounds?
I'll note at the beginning of this collection of bits I picked up in a few searches that quite a few hits go to Piney.com and Piney-2.com. I tried to figure out just what it is--the site seems to have no statement of ownership, management, or raison d'etre, except that it seems to promoting scholarship to do with biblical details, to be debunking some forms of christian belief, and seems to be tied to a particular pastor named Rubel Shelly.
Rubel Shelly is the most visible participant in an effort to restructure churches of Christ into Community Churches. Because negative comments are blacklisted from FaithMatters on FaithSite.com perhaps to allow judgmental and negative comments to stand unchallenged, we offer the following Biblical corrections to published or posted sermons.
With this puzzlment regarding the source of some really interesting information noted, here is some of what I uncovered regarding the term "jubal hounds." --SRS
Piney.com Pepperdine link
Victor Knowles, Teacher Victor Knowles, like many instrumental churches, seems obsessed with UNITING with what they despairingly call "a cappella churches." This is consistent with the oldest story, told in many forms, about the Jubal or Genun character. Satan seduces him into leading people into using instruments (weapons) to enchant others to steal their "sheep." When he discovers that he has fallen beyond redemption, his life's work is to try to seduce everyone else to AFFIRM his own repudiation of the Living Word. Perhaps there is a clue about the MARK in that CAIN means "a musical note" and Jubal "handled" musical instruments meaning WITHOUT AUTHORITY. We have collected three dozen versions of this story including that of The Book of Enoch which Jude used to warn that God will come with ten thousand of His saints. The very FAILURE is that of using MUSIC as the "Lucifer Principle" to bleed off worship from God.
(Genun information--this name/term in general seems to generate some kind of squishy sci-fi pop-christian interest along with the scholarship--see my Google search on Genun.
Also from Piney.com, what I posted above
Yôbâl (Jubal) and Tôbalkin (Tubal-Cain), the two brethren, the sons of Lamech, the blind man, who killed Cain, invented and made all kinds of instruments of music.
Jôbâl made reed instruments, and harps, and flutes, and whistles,
and the devils went and dwelt inside them.
When men blew into the pipes, the devils sang inside them,
and sent out sounds from inside them.
This is a very interesting (albeit brief) discussion of this character/subject:
 ONE SHOULD not slander music by charging it with being an ally of the frivolities of courtiers, although many frivolous individuals endeavor by its help to advance their own interests. Music is indeed one of the liberal arts and it has an honorable origin whether it claims Pythagoras, Moses, or Tubal,77 the father of those who play upon the harp, as the author of its being. Because of the great power exercised by it, its many forms, and the harmonies that serve it, it embraces the universe; that is to say, it reconciles the clashing and dissonant relations of all that exists and of all that is thought and expressed in words by a sort of ever varying but still harmonious law derived from its own symmetry. By it the phenomena of the heavens are ruled and the activities of the world and men are governed. Its instruments form and fashion conduct and, by a kind of miracle of nature, clothe with melodies and colorful forms of rhymes and measures the tone of the voice, whether expressed in words or not, and adorn them as with a robe of beauty.
77 Gen. vi. 21. Tubal was the form of Jubal used in the Middle Ages
This would lead me to interpret "Jubal Hounds" as the dissonant clammoring barking of dogs, ungodly, noisy, and distracting at the very least--SRS
(google search on "tubal jubal)
I could keep opening links and reading, cutting and pasting, but I'll conclude that the connection was clearly made in literary circles, as demonstrated by Kipling:
Jubal and Tubal Cain
JUBAL sang of the Wrath of God
And the curse of thistle and thorn—
But Tubal got him a pointed rod,
And scrabbled the earth for corn.
Old—old as that early mould,
Young as the sprouting grain—
Yearly green is the strife between
Jubal and Tubal Cain
Jubal sang of the new-found sea,
And the love that its waves divide—
But Tubal hollowed a fallen tree
And passed to the further side.
Black—black as the hurricane-wrack,
Salt as the under-main—
Bitter and cold is the hate they hold—
Jubal and Tubal Cain!
Jubal sang of the golden years
When wars and wounds shall cease—
But Tubal fashioned the hand-flung spears
And showed his neighbours peace.
New—new as the Nine point Two,
Older than Lamech's slain—
Roaring and loud is the feud avowed
Twix' Jubal and Tubal Cain!
Jubal sang of the cliffs that bar
And the peaks that none may crown—
But Tubal clambered by jut and scar
And there he builded a town.
High—high as the snowsheds lie,
Low as the culverts drain—
Wherever they be they can never agree—
Jubal and Tubal Cain!
(I don't know what the note "Canadian" is about--did Kipling live in Canada for a while?)
I'm adding this poem because it offers a literary interpretation of a relationship, but I'm not in any way shape or form a biblical scholar who can make much of the myth as presented here. I'm not a christian and haven't read the bible, but at the same time, I read a lot of other stuff and tend to recognise biblical references when they pop up. So I'll leave it to someone who has more expertise in the field to sort it out. This is raw data.