All the stuff above not withstanding, the US has no right still being in Iraq. That, pal, should be the whole point of the thread. Arguing as to whether 20000 or 100000 civilians have been killed is futile. One is too many in a bullshit war. Fabricated evidence to invade, and crap spin to stay. America is out of control, and that is being orchestrated by folks in Washington. Period.