Thanks Earl for the words, it's the one & the same, I'll be trying for the tune now. LaMarca, thanks for info & direction, I think I'll go see Wally. Yes, I'm the Finn in Finn & Haddie. I may end up at Nomad, we'll also be at NEFFA again, if I can get this years early application out by the 20th. Get in touch, the applications for NEFFA are due this month. Barry Finn