Therein lies the quandry, Keith.

On the one hand you have a fairly splintered enough Republican movement: There is the I.N.L.A, the Real I.R.A, (who planted the Omagh Bombs, remember), the

I.P.L.O., the I.R.S.P, the Continuity I.R.A. Group B., and the I.R.A. itself... all ideologically different to a large extent (though the focus of their struggle was, and

always has been the removal of the British presence on our mainland); only one of whom ever declared a proper ceasefire.

On the other hand you have a fairly splintered enough Loyalist movement; engaged in a territorial feud (Eastasia/Eurasia), ideologically united in their main

goal, however: the sectarian murder of Catholics... for NO OTHER REASON than for the fact that they are Catholics. That is their main goal, Keith.

Politically they have always been the majority. Why else would they try and intimidate as many of us as possible out of their country?
If more than 5 percent of the Catholic population had have been murdered in the North of Ireland, the figure would have been enough to warrant the term 'Genocide'
So let's get a few things in perspective, here, Keith.

I am reminded of a Jeremy Paxman (I'm almost certain it was him) interview with Oliver Tambo, the former leader in exile of the A.N.C., many years ago, where

Paxman chided Tambo for not being more in control of his Organisation. (... they were killing rich White folks at an incredible rate, in fairness...).
Tambo told Paxman that it was precisely because of the A.N.C's. very tight control of his Organisation that the whole place hadn't been totally overrun long

before now, like some sort of modern day Isandlwana.

As Hazel Blears MP has told Dave "We cannot force paramilitary organisations to decommission".
No truer words were ever spoken.
So why has the I.R.A. offered the hand of peace in this way?
To set the ball rolling, gentle readers!

The Loyalists only want to hold on to the ball, Keith.
You know that. Tam the man knows that (... somebody give him a wee nudge, there...). If Barry O doesn't know it by now, then he's an ignorant

twat; Augusto Pinochet up the thread there, even knows it, despite the otherwise total lack of brain-cells in describing this thread as 'Pro I.R.A.'

There may well come a time when the I.R.A. as such, are in the minority, though.
The longer this stalemate plays out, the more the voices of discontent within the ranks can have the tendency to surface.
The more that happens, the more anti-Agreement splinter groups there become.
Anyone ever taken that thought to it's logical conclusion?

Ireland has been down this road before, Keith. So has England.
Denying the Nationalist population their rights has always landed the British into trouble.
I have heard words like 'This should never be allowed to happen again' bandied around in the last number of days, in other contexts.
Is anyone reading the writing on the wall?

You see what we have here, Keith, is an long established establishment in the North of Ireland. You have a charasmatic figurehead who preaches fundementalism and

hatred of his fellow man. You have a biased British media who, at its most pitiful, will claim the Irishman as their own if he wins the Tour de France or appears in a

film with Samuel L. Jackson, but will return him back to us the minute he becomes No. 2, or shags somebody that isn't his wife.You have a Police Force which still

harks itself back to the good old days of the R.U.C. And of course you have the 'Reservists'. Where did they go, I wonder? These perfectly legitimate arms of Law

Enforcement in the North of Ireland?
Now, if you are the kind of person who forgets names like 'Windscale', well then perhaps I have been writing far too cryptically for you, all along.

I thank you though, Keith; Dave, especially for starting this particular ball rolling. Tory Boy, Gervase, and all who did take the trouble to mail their MP at my request,

fair play to all of you.
You asked the proper questions, Dave and Keith, but in my opinion, you were replied with platitudes.
That, of course, had nothing to do with you; it's just the way things are.... and unfortunately have been down through the years.

Odd, though, how a thread calling for Loyalist weapons to be taken off the streets, can turn into a "what about Robert McCartney" thread.

HAL-LO-OH?

This has been the 12th of July, folks; the Gregorian equivalent of the original Battle of The Boyne, and as the Curator has pointed out, the same message of HATE

was preached from the podiums at their gatherings. What they want the LVF and UVF to do, is to stop the internal feuding: i.e. to stop killing themselves. Indeed I

heard no mention of the grave need for the Unionists to get into dialogue to help sort out the 'current impasse' in any of the news reports that I have seen or heard.

Gerry Adams and Martin McGuinness do it all the time, however.

I'll write that again...

GERRY ADAMS AND MARTIN McGUINNESS DO IT ALL THE TIME, HOWEVER

Gerry tried to talk to the Police today in Belfast, to get them to be a bit more gentle in their

handling of that PEACEFUL PROTEST, and the stewards and himself were water cannoned for their efforts.
Burntollet all over again... .... there's also a little mention of our old friends, the Continuity I.R.A in that piece, incidentally.
It was also interesting to hear Gerry say to the News media that it was a "sizeable job trying to manage the situation" in the face of unnecessary heavy-handedness by

our newly renamed, and therefore, squeaky clean, Police Service of Northern Ireland.

Anybody reading Oliver Tambo's words with respect to this situation?

Ian Paisley for his part, called for the "root and branch destruction" of the IRA and its

weapons, and said that loyalist paramilitaries must also cease their activities.

Cease their activities!
Nothing remotely rootish or branchish about that chastisement, now is there?
Vane and Cromwell's terminology doesn't apply to their own....

Read Brendy's article on the Orange Order, that I stumbled across: here, and you get an insight into the Unionist/Loyalist mindset. There's enough

material on this site for those who want to see the wood. Flamenco Ted obviously is quite happy with the trees; it gives him something to piss up against, while

he's tally ho-ing along with the rest of his priviliged-class mates.
Get yourselves educated in the subject you want to discuss, and lay off the I.R.A until you know and accept what the alternatives are.
If you don't, you are ignoring at least 70% of the problem, and then you would warrant the title of 'Ignorant Twat', just like Barry O, Augusto Pinoted (like,

how much do you trust the wanker you voted for?), and selected others have earned themselves.
Then you would have to put up with us putting you right all the time.

And you don't like us doing that, do you?
Being educated by people you see as beneath you?

Brucie, you have been an absolute gem, my man!
I thank you for your engagement in this, far flung from the situation as you geographically are. A gentleman if ever there was one!
Everyone else who has contributed to keep this thread alive, kudos also from the bottom of my heart.
If I can judge anything by your comments, future discussions on the North of Ireland should never be the same as they have been to date.

Tomorrow the Sham Fight is in Scarva.
Now there's pitiful....

I'm off to Donegal.... See you soon, Tír Chonaill!!

Tiocfaidh Ardara!