Then, TIA, your experience is different than mine. I, too, am put off by any kind of fundamentalist that seems to think that only they have the answer. But I am just as put off when a discussion is going on, and the non religionists speak as if I am not there in very condescending tones. Happens all the time. I too eschew labels. My beliefs and personal code are based on much reflection. My religious community is just that.

I would disagree with you on the statement re: living in a profoundly secular world. I think it is apparent that the world is more and more secular.

Finally, your statement with regard to being spoken to in denigrating tones is exactly what I often get when I simply indicate that I have a faith based perspective. Before we can even get into the discussion of my decidedly non traditional Christian/Pagan views, I am relegated to the corner.

Richard Bridge, you speak of consensus, yet I don't see a consensus at all. It's an old debaters trick. Your "policing" idea has been tried already. It is part of the reason there was an American Revolution. The idea that anyone should be able to protect me from myself with regard to religious beliefs, based on your idea of what harms me seems ludicrous. Are you suggesting that the only religions that should be allowed are those that meet criteria established by some governing body?

Grab, you speak of faith communities being "not deserving of followers". Are you suggesting that you or some body should have the right to determine that?

The best of this thread, IMO only, so far, seems to be found in the comments of Amos, Paul Burke, Stigweard, Wolfgang, and a few others. They have given me much to ponder, and I appreciate that.