good point, guest prs.
            to M DOUGLAS. But the process of learning orally, is bound to change with the advent of the computer,. If I learn a song words or tune, via the computer, have I learnt it orally. or is it learned orally, only if I have done so by listening to a cd[ did that person learn it orally], but not from written music [ even if he was C SHARP who had written it down from an oral source].
    last point, If I go to the VAUGHAN WILLIAMS LIBRARY and learn from a book, the Seeds of love, as collected by Cecil Sharp, does the song cease to be traditional, because I have not learned it orally, But continue to be traditional if i learned it from a recording made by Sharp [ if there is one].
but yet if I asked people at a festival or club,afterI had played/ sung it,[ and they were ignorant of how I had acquired it,] I am sure they would say its traditonal,Dick Miles