There is a lot to be said for being inclusive, Bryan (I used to be Mr Rusty when I had a Reliant 3 wheeler btw:-) ) and it is what we do at Swinton as well. On a SINGERS night anyone can get on and, like I said, we charge anything between nothing and 50p. We do encourage active participation in the raffle as well though;-) I am rarely on the door now as I am in a self imposed exile in Newcastle through the week but for the 20-odd years I did the door, MC-ing and organising I would honestly explain to any new face at the door that it was a singers night and that anything could, and often did, happen. We have had some appaling performers but conversely we have had some magnificent nights. You pays your money (not much!) and take your chance. I don't think anyone has ever been dissappointed.

On a guest night, be it a local big name, national or international artist, I would not dream of putting one of our more dire performers on. Many reasons for that but the main ones are that the big names often have their own following who have never been to Swinton before. I don't want to leave them with a bad impression. Secondly, even though we only usualy charge £3, I still believe that we need to give good value for money. If we put 2 floor singers on in each half, say 2 15 minute spots, and those floor spots are particularly bad then we are doing no favours to either the audience or the main perfomer.

Before anyone says it - Yes I know that £3 is far to little but now I am in Newcastle I cannot apply the pressure any more! It is actualy £2.50 members and £3.50 non-memebers! When it is a bigger name than usual we will sometimes charge £5 for non-members. I would prefer to charge £5 across the board and when I run my 'specials' I always leave it to the artist what to charge - It has been consistantly £6 up to now.

You have said you would put anyone on again, no matter how bad - So would I. But just when and how would you put them on? During a Martin Carthy concert with 50 paying? I don't think you would be doing the audience or the floor singer any good if you did. During a singers night where everyone is friends and will encourage others? Of course! I think all anyone contributing to this thread wants is to ensure the sucess of traditional music. Making sure that the people who want only the best get it and those who want to practise in public are allowed to is that tight rope that us organisers are, for some strange reason, willing to walk!

Cheers

Dave