As PoppaGator wrote on 04 Apr 07 - 02:53 PM

"I don't think we can "nail down" any definitive meanings for any of this stuff (unfamiliar words, etc.) that comes from the Mardi Gras Indians. As someone mentioned above, today's Indians themselves no longer know what all the words and phrases mean!"

-snip-

Also, as GUEST,guitarist wrote on 13 Jul 00 - 12:15 PM :

"heh, it's a big subject -- people make careers out of question less complicated than this. It's interesting to follow the trail, but don't get hung up on absolute answers, you won't find many.

Jockomo fi na ne / Brother John is gone, that's one hypothesis, there are many others -- just pick one you like. :) "

-snip-

I agree that 1} it's interesting to follow the trail and 2} if you get hung up on absolute answers [in the unfamiliar words that are included in the Mardi Gras Indian songs] you won't find many [absolute answers].

I also agree that 3} "Brother John is gone" is one hypothesis for the meaning of "Jockomo fi na ne" and 4} there are many others and 5} you should just pick one you like.

And I also agree with Guest guitarist that you should smile about the whole thing since sometimes being too serious can weigh you down.

That said, may I suggest {or re-suggest if it has been mentioned before} that there are literal meanings for words & phrases and there are colloquial meanings for those same words & phrases. And though it certainly is interesting to try to trace a word or phrase back to its/their etymological roots, it's the street meaning that is most important when you're trying to figure out what a word or phrase means to the singer and his/her audience.

Members of the Mardi Gras Indians may not know the etymological meaning of the phrase "Jacomo fi na ne", but I think they do know what it means when they say it.

I prefer Bob Coltman's [and others] conclusion that a "Jacomo" = a jester, jokester." But I don't think the Mardi Gras Indians mean/meant "You're a jokester" when they say/said "Jacomo fi na ne".

And when the Mardi Gras Indians sing/sang "Jacomo fi na ne", I don't think they are/were saying, "John is dead". It makes more sense to me that they are/were saying "Well go f***k yourself". Or maybe they are/were saying "You're a fool". If we go with this meaning, than we'd have to note that "Jacomo fi na ne" is/would have been sung in a real put-down/dissin manner with "fool" {Jacomo} used as a substitute for the latest, most insulting street term that means something like "fool".

These are just two theories. I'm sticking with door #1.

But all this to say that trying to figure out where this phrase came from is one thing {or multiple things as the phrase might have had multiple origins}. And we can only speculate about those origins.

But it's a whole 'nuther thing to ask contemporary Mardi Gras Indians what the phrase means to them, and what they understood folks in the past thought the phrase meant. In addition, it seems to me that folks interested in the "real" meaning of this phrase should look at the phrase in its context. How is/was the phrase used in the the context of songs and in the context of the competitive and often dangerous encounters between one group of Mardi Gras Indian and rival groups or persons who aren't {weren't} associated with their group or any other Mardi Gras Indian group? Does this jibe with the meaning that people who use it give? If so, we have struck gold.

So again, I'm sticking with door #1 {btw this "door #1" is a referent to the loong running American tv game show "The Price Is Right" and has nothing to do with the "Jacomo fi na ne" phase itself}

But if you don't like what I'm sayin then Jacomo-

Naw. I really don't mean that. It's a joke. Get it? "A joke"? Ha Ha. Oh, I'm such a jokester {and when I say "jokester" here, I mean something good, not something insulting}.

Get it?

No?

Okay...moving right along...

Instead of the door #1 sentiments in and for my weak attempt at Jacomo witticism, I'd like to end this post echoing what GUEST,sandi said in her 04 Apr 07 - 10:36 AM post:

"At least there is a real discussion going on here - even if none of us seem to know the meaning of the words."