i must say, i have enjoyed reading this thread.
i found it by chance while looking for the version of this song that i most enjoy. since there are so many variations i don't think it matters so much which is perfectly original. as it has become a song that has been changed and modified over hundreds of years to suit the tale teller.

i have a particular interest in the song because my grandma sang it to me all the time when i was a child. her name is Barbara Ellen and her dad sang it to her. and i was named after her, my middle name is Barbara-Ellen (yes, with a hyphen). also, while reading online exerts from the diary of Samuel Pepys i saw the piece about his dear Mrs. Knipp, whom he so fondly referred to.

"Mrs. Knipp"



Seems like if she was a "Mrs" she had to have been married to a "Mr" and she had a little something going on the side there with Mr. Pepys. i thought that was kind of funny. but mostly i was shocked that he would refer to the song and to a Mrs. Knipp in the same paragraph, Not only for the Barbara Ellen (Allen) reference, but because Knipp is also a family name for me. My grandmother's maiden name was Barbara Ellen Knipp.

Ellen is a family name passed down also.. (likewise, "ALLEN" is also a family name that has carried on my father's side of the family and my husband's family also. but not so much as a surname)
Anyway, The eldest daughter of the eldest daughter, etc. has always been given the name Ellen in some sort of arrangement. If the eldest daughter had no daughters then the second-eldest daughter, or son if a lack for more daughters, carried on the name. I personally think that this had something to do with the reference in an above post regarding the power women held in old scots society. celt and pictish women were allowed more power than other women in other societies, and that was undermined, overthrown and revoked with the corruption and invasion of the roman catholic empire.

Also, in that part of my family (the Knipps, also very scot/irish with other euro influences e.g. german), 9 out of 10 women are the "boss". maybe a coincidence, but seems like a generational trait that has carried on.

i found much useful information here. as well as a few laughs... which i really needed. and if anyone has light to shed on the "Knipp's" I would love to hear it, as there is not a lot of recorded information on my own Knipp roots. mostly stories handed down from relatives that are gone now.