The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #49672   Message #2382361
Posted By: Azizi
06-Jul-08 - 11:34 AM
Thread Name: Origins: Ring around the Rosy / Rosey
Subject: RE: Origins: Ring around the Rosy / Rosey
The first rhyme that I think has some similarities with "Green Sally Up" {what I call version #1, The Sounds of South" CD version} is the rhyme that Dicho posted on this thread in 2002

Ring around a rosey, pocket full o' posies,
Light bread, Sweet bread, Squat!
Guess who she told me, tralalalala,
Mister Red was her lover, tralalalala,
If you love him, hug him!
If you hate him, stomp!

-snip-

Source: Lomax and Lomax, 1939 Southern States Collecting Trip, from Wiergate, Texas: (Sec. 13, Merryville, LA and vicinity)

-snip-

I call this version "Louisiana Ring Around The Rosie" because Lomax and Lomax collected it from Louisiana {LA].

The last two lines of that rhyme remind me of the lines "If you hate it fold your arms/ If you love it clap your hands" in version #1 of "Green Sally Up" as given above. Also, version #1 of "Green Sally Up" and that Louisiana version of "Ring Around The Rosie" both include the word "squat".

Actually, as Q has shared with us in this thread, a number of Southern American versions of "Ring Around The Rosie" include the word "squat".

Here are reposts of two of these examples from Q's post above:

Ring around the rosie,
Squat among the posies,
Ring around the roses,
Pockets full of posies,
One, two, three- *squat!
-snip-

Should this be called "Ring Around The Rosie, Squat} to distinquish it from other Ring Around The Rosie" examples?

A Ring, A Ring, A Raney
A ring, a ring, a raney
Buttermilk and tansy,
Flower here and flower there,
And all- squat!

-snip-

I call this version "A Ring, A Ring, A Raney". I know that ring means circle, but what does "raney" mean?

Both of these examples are from the same source: W. W. Newell, Games and Songs of American Children, 1883, (1903), Dover reprint.

If the African American game song "Green Sally Up" originally had as it's source the British game song "Ring Around The Rosie" ,then it eventually became an entirely different song-as seen by the "Step It Down" version. Of course, any "early" connection between these two game songs is speculation on my part. But I believe that it's worth a thought or two.

My thanks to Dicho, Malcolm Douglas, and Q for jump starting my thoughts about a possible connections between "Green Sally Up" and "Ring Around The Rosie". I'm interested in any comments that folks here might have about these speculations.

Btw, this page of my website devoted to "Green Sally Up" contains most of these comments and more, including my thanks and a hyperlink to this thread:

http://cocojams.com/green_sally_up__song.htm