At least it didn't turn out to have been written by Brendan Behan! Caught me out a few times, he has.

Interesting thought Bert. I'd have said a 'traditional' song is one that is now or has been propagated by 'folk methods' - learned in the pub, or from yer mam, or featured in a collection of popular ballads, etc - *and* which isn't also propagated by the "official" music industry process (copyright sheet music in the past, these days, recorded by the author).

This would mean that songs like Fiddlers Green, which have detatched themselves from their author, still aren't trad, because they are also propagated by the author's recordings and performances. John Dowland's Madrigals aren't trad, even though they were sung for amusement in private houses for a hundred years, and were probably often propagated by one person teaching another, because he published them in books complete with the tablature for lute accompaniment - the 'official' process of the day.

It would also mean that Brendan Behan's contributions to Irish folk music (did he write the third verse of *everything*?) ARE trad, because he never published them in anthologies like he did his poetry, he just 'let it be known' that he had - or might have - added a bit to Carrickfergus, or The Eniskillin Fusiliers, or whatever.