Ruth, I gather from your posts that you live in the USA and your family are Sicilian Americans.

As such, it is unlikely that you would be aware that defining English culture is a real challenge and a topic of genuine importance.

I am not English and did not grow up here - or even in Europe - or even in the west for that matter.

So I have no prejudice when I make the following comments.

Young British men and women today, of all ethnic backgrounds, are part of a generation unlike any other in British history.

50 years ago, the idea of a multicoloured/multicultured nation of brits would have been inconceivable to most Brits of that time.

I spent 12 years living in Leicester, where whites make up the largest minority by a slim margin.

Unlike America, this has only been the case for a comparatively short time.

The United States was, successfully or unseccessfully, constructed of numerous cultures going right back to the days of its creation.

In 1958, Leicester was white.

Now, 50 years later, it is a model of multiculturalism and integration.

The success of leicester contrasts with the comparative failure of Bradford where integration has been much less successful.

In their attempts to celebrate diversity, Schools in leicester (as in the rest of the UK) celebrate events such as Black History month, they are supportive of Islamic, Hindu, Jewish, Jain, Seikh and a whole host of other traditions.

This in itself is all good and positive and serves to make racial and cultural minorities feel welcome in the UK and consolidates their right to be there - as it should be.

And for many middle class whites, this is something that isn't threatening, so they are happy to participate in the process.

For many uneducated whites however, who are not informed about the "british legacy," and who are proud of their identity, but aren't very good at expresing themselves, and wwho are vulnerable to the predations of groups like the BNP, they can feel marginalized and that, while evryone elses culture is being celebrated, theirs isn't.

In fact, for the working classes, their culture, football, songs, pastimes etc are positively sneered at. Not least by what they perceive as the treacherous middle classes with their bleeding heart liberal views.

Their brand of Englishness is "excused" and apologised for and consequently it retreats into itself, distorts and takes on an ugly persona.

The overall result of the nations desire to reassure its newest citizens, is that the need to assert an "English" Identity is supressed and viewed as being a bit embarrassing.

A large segment of white England "feels" disenfranchised, and just as minorities deserve reassurance that their culture has a useful and relevant role to play in British culture, so "native" English also deserve the same reassurance and attention.

"Englishness" isn't celebrated in the same way as Blackness is.

One of the main reasons for this is that it has become very difficult to define.

Black Britain knows its roots, because Black British people know the value of knowing your roots.

English culture and roots arent celebrated in the same way.

They are considered taboo subjects and discussed carefully.

British culture is evolving very quickly, and in my opinion very maturely. The question of "indigenous" English heritage is one which has been brushed under the carpet for diplomacy's sake, but it is becoming clear that it should be brought out more into the open lest it go undergound into the sewers and mutate into something the BNP can exploit more easily.

St Georges day is now sadly considered synonymous with skinheads, the BNP and general aggression.

The only alternative given to the English is to celebrate Englishness as defined by multiculturalism.

But then the working class kid thinks "hey - he gets to be "english" and "Black" but I only get to be "English" - what is it about my roots that makes me special like him.

Of course if he were reassured properly he might see that Blackness isn't an exclusive thing, but that just as Black British youth are constructed of both English and African ingredients, it is also true that most white english youth feel a certain "blackness" in themselves that their parents never had - in their music, dancing, slang, and of course on deeper more substantive levels too.

Anyway, as you can see, the whole can of worms is exponentially complex.

Lizzie is right.

Englishness is a sensetive subject and it shouldn't be.

To add to that, there is an aspect of Englishness that doesn't include multiculturalism that can be celebrated, and to remember fondly actual experiences should not be considered good reason to be accused of selling a chocolate box view of Englishness.

Finally however, as interesting as this discussion is, it isn't actually the purpose of this thread as I read it.

But this thread is symptomatic of a wider mature evolution of English society.