Aw Jim!! How predictable, attack the poster and ignore the points raised.

From your side of this discussion it would actually have been rather nice to have been presented with facts, instead what you came up with were tired old myths, half-truths and lies. Want a list of them Jim??

Example 1:
"We have found out to our cost here in Ireland over the last three decades that, no matter what your point of view on nationalism, while one country persists on occupying another, the outcome is inevitably vicious and bloody."

What country persisted in occupying what country Jim?? The question is as yet unanswered by Jim the "Brit" - Jim don't you find being referred to as a "Brit" offensive? Aren't you outraged?? Terribly racist you know just as bad as referring to somebody from Pakistan a "Paki".

Northern Ireland is and always has been part of the United Kingdom. So tell me Jim over the last three decades what country persisted in occupying what country? - How can a country "occupy" itself??

Example 2:
"The whole of Ireland was a full colony of Britain (it's oldest) up to 1922."

Really Jim?? Not according to our mutual friend Kevin who signs himself as MGOH. Can you dredge though your fantasy book of history and explain to everybody how Ireland could achieve the status of integral part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland (1801 Act of Union) and still be a "colony" at one in the same time??

"Britain, because of its partitioning of Ireland, bears full responsibility for all the violence that has taken place here."

But as we have seen and as is recorded and documented as historical fact, the British did not partion Ireland did they?? That was the choice of the people of Northern Ireland. Or perhaps you feel as though Britain should have ignored the wishes and desires of that section of people? If they had done so the "civil war" that the South exerienced in 1922 would have looked like a pub brawl compared to the one that would have been fought had the South tried to force the North into a united independent Ireland in 1922. The prospect of this happening was fully realised by all parties in the negotiations that led to the creation of the Irish Free State and that is why the opt out was included in the treaty and ALL parties agreed to it.

Example 3:
"There has never been a vote on the question of whether to remain as part of Britain,
Ireland was a colony until 1922, then it was partitioned and six counties were retained as part of Britain - that's what the 'troubles' were about."

Every time the people of Northern Ireland go to the Polling Station there is a vote on whether or not Northern Ireland remains part of Britain.

We've dealt with the "colony" crap up above, and chapter and verse has been provided to show quite clearly that Northern Ireland came into being because that is what the majority of people living there wanted at the time and all polls taken on the subject indicate that they still prefer the status quo.

Oh and Brit Jim the "Troubles" much as you would like to think of them as having to do with the "struggle" for the unification of Ireland they had more to do with the Northern Irish Human Rights Movement which the bulk of the population in the UK totally supported. The Official IRA recognised that and stayed clear, the eejits of the Provisional IRA jumped in to pour petrol on the fire and set about murdering those they were purportedly "protecting". As to blood being on anybodies hands then the PIRA and the other paramilitaries must shoulder responsibility for the major portion of it.

"Every drop of blood shed from 1922 is down to British rule." Utter nonsense, one set of clowns decided to impose their views and visions on the general population by force of arms, they were countered by another set of clowns with the opposite point of view. All the Governments of both the UK and Ireland ever tried to do was end the carnage. I've asked this before Jim maybe you can give me an answer - name one member of any paramilitary group involved in the "Troubles" who sacrificed his or her life to save the life of an innocent by-stander in Northern Ireland - There are numerous examples of precisely that among members of the armed forces, security forces and emergency services.

Example 4:
"I understand that a visit from the queen is being contemplated at present and that one of the items on her agenda will be a speech apologising for British misrule."

Now I wonder if that did actually occur would it work?? Would that be it? Would a line be drawn under it?? Somehow doubt it, don't you?

As a "Brit" Jim, where does this total ignorance of our constitutional monarchy, its powers and restraints come from??

One minor point Jim-Lad - As a Constitutional Monarch the Queen cannot make such a speech as you refer to, the Prime Minister can, the Queen cannot, she's not allowed to.

So there are instances of British misrule are there Jim - Hardly surprising that, quite human, I know it must be hard living in a world where no-one is as perfect as yourself. Can you give us any examples of Governments that have never made mistakes Jim?? I'd be very interested in reviewing that list.