Exactly, Keith - that's what they have chaplains *for*. That's one of the things that makes it *not* OK for a medical employee to offer prayer. I mean, the hospital has plumbers, too, and the nurse doesn't expect to unclog toilets.

I might add that the chaplain was *very* helpful to me when I was in hospital trying not to have the twins too too too prematurely (they eventually made it to 30 weeks), and even more so when I was in labor and my late ex(tra asshole) didn't show up about 12 hours... she had found out very early, of course, that I was an atheist, and offered nothing spiritual, didn't even say Well I'll pray for you but you don't have to participate at all. She just figured I was the one who needed a hand to hold right now, and she held it (metaphorically at first, then literally). I wouldn't get *her* fired either.

Then again, I'm not sure that secular comforting is out of the purview of a chaplain the way that religious comforting is out of that of a nurse. I mean, a chaplain's job is to comfort, and since they can do it nondenominationally they can do it denomination-free-ly, no?

We did, before the labor (that is while I could hold a rational conversation) *discuss* my atheism, and her faith, but it was conversational, not evangelical. We were both curious about the other. We also talked about a lot of other stuff, like how I was going to handle preemie twins in the real world.

Meanwhile, back when I was first hospitalized, the nurses had asked me if I wanted to meet another woman on our floor (the problem maternity ward) who had just had very preemie twins, one of whom was not expected to live. They just thought it might be helpful for both of us (I presume they had already asked her). I said yes, of course, and we talked a bit but very early, she said she was placing her faith in [her] god. I said well, I'm an atheist, and I'm placing my faith in the medical center and its stellar record with preemies. I thought we'd then go on and talk about our fears for our various feti and babies, but no, she couldn't get past it, and all she would talk about was how I needed to have faith in the supernatural instead. It got to where I had to tell the nurses to just her away from me, which they *completely* understood. And seemed to take as part of their job in keeping me pregnant and under the best possible *medical* care. (They were nice about it, and told her I was sleeping.)

We also had this come up when my Mom's heart surgeon found out Mom was a holocaust survivor and went all yiddish-y and god-y (which he hadn't been before!) and I had to take him outside and say cut the crap, we're atheists and we're here for a medical issue (as a biological scientist I'm the central contact with medical stuff for Mom, just as my sister the lawyer is for the legal stuff, in case you're wondering why I took it upon myself). We didn't want him *fired* but it was insulting as all getout, and it outraged Mom which was exactly what she didn't need right then, she had come for quadruple bypass surgery.

Do either of these anecdotes change anybody's mind?