The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #7774   Message #2585962
Posted By: Azizi
10-Mar-09 - 06:49 PM
Thread Name: lyr req: jump n' jivin'
Subject: RE: lyr req: jump n' jivin'
Here's some more information about the etymology of the word "jive":

http://everything2.com/title/jive 's entry for the word "jive" indicates that

"The word appears to have originated in black American English; the exact origin is "unknown". Meaning number one is our favorite. It's a noun: "Talk that is misleading, untrue, empty". It's a verb, too: L. Armstrong, 1928: "Don't Jive Me", "title of phonograph record". There's even an adjectival form: "jive-ass", first appearing in print 1964"...

-snip0

That entry goes on to provide another adjectival form that has something to do with a person's mother. Since I'm such a good girl, I substitute that jive-ass adjectival form for "jive bucket-head". I've no idea where I got that from). And I can't bring myself to write that other form, let alone say it to someone.

The editor of Everything.com also writes that "The OED tells us that the noun "jive" first appeared in 1928, in the capable hands of somebody named R. Fisher Wells, in a book called Walls of Jericho, and then again a year later by T. Gordon in Born to Be. Born to be what? Dunno. Both used it in sense one, as above. Over time, we see the world change: The last citation given for sense one is from Black World, October 1973: "...total liberation, unification, and empowerment of Afrika... Anything short of that is jive."

There are other minor meanings: "A fast, lively type of jazz"; "lively and uninhibited dancing... jitterbugging"; marijuana, or a joint thereof (the alternate spelling "gyve" is given as found in the San Francisco Call-Bulletin, 1938; we're not convinced that the good folks at the Call-Bulletin knew what they were talking about).

The other big meaning there is a variety of American English associated with Harlem, with black Americans, and with jazz musicians; "see also jive talk", it says, but doesn't mention the Bee Gees. That's probably just as well. What's best, though, is that the first citation given for this sense is from 1938, from a man identified as "C. Calloway", and a work identified as "Hi De Ho". And of course we all remember that fine cinematic milestone Airplane, and the nice, helpful old lady who announces, "I speak jive!"

**

Speaking of Africa (or Afrika, which is the Black nationalist spelling of that continent's name),in his 1994 dictionary of African American slang Juba To Jive editor Clarence Major writes that 'jive' is "a Wolof [West African word] meaning "gossip, false talk, con game, loose talk, to sneer".
-snip-

I have a friend who is Wolof who immigrated to the USA years ago from The Gambia. I asked him about this etymology, and he agreed with Clarence Major. But maybe he was jivin me.