The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #115854   Message #2622971
Posted By: Don Firth
01-May-09 - 10:52 PM
Thread Name: BS: Californians Oppose 'Prop 8' Gay Marriage Ban
Subject: RE: BS: Californians Oppose 'Prop 8' Gay Marriage Ban
Little Hawk, I'll be gone for awhile, but here are some selected readings:

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The expectation that men should abandon their judgment is the desire that men reject their ability to reason. In fact, when the Bible states "Judge not, that ye be not judged," the implicit motivation to refrain from judging is the fear of someone else's judgment. Many believers may say that this means we should not condemn others, but this verse makes no mention of either condemning or others. Besides, there are times when it is morally proper to condemn others. I would never expect or ask others to "judge not" or to suspend their ability to reason. In fact, I purposefully seek those who are not willing to abandon their intellectual and moral judgment. I delight in the use of my mind, which means I delight in my ability to pass sound judgments about things and people. Also, I fear neither the judgment nor the condemnation of others, because I do not accept the implicit assumption that others are in some way superior to me, such that their judgment and/or condemnation is be something I should fear. Rather, I adopt the principle: Judge, and be prepared to be judged.

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We are thinking critically when we recognize the relevance and/or merit of alternative assumptions and perspectives recognize the extent and weight of evidence.

I've been in a number of social situations where I've heard these phrases all too often:

•        "Everyone is entitled to their own truth."
•        "There's no such thing as good and evil."
•        "Judge not lest you be judged."

These statements are not the product of critical thinking. Arguably these statements result from a LACK of critical thought. While part of being critical is to thoroughly examine all aspects of any statement, fact, or opinion, the essence of being critical is NOT to withhold judgement, but to render it.

Nothing can corrupt and disintegrate a culture or a man's character as thoroughly as does the precept of moral agnosticism, the idea that one must never pass moral judgment on others, that one must be morally tolerant of anything, that the good consists of never distinguishing good from evil.

Don't you find it strange that people associate judgment or the act of judging with a negative connotation? This is a product of society and a natural tendency for many people to be neutral fence-sitters, and abdicate responsibility by not rendering any judgment whatsoever.

The goal of exercising critical thought is not to strive for absolute neutrality—which doesn't benefit anyone. We don't become critical thinkers just for the sake of criticism. The goal is to strive for the truth, and to reject untruth. The goal is to strive for the good and to reject the evil. This is a very difficult goal to attain, but it is the motivation that should inspire us to continue to question ourselves, our world, our existence. It will always be an ongoing process, and one fraught with mistakes–but that should not frighten us into becoming fence-sitters who sanction anything.

It is fairly easy to grasp abstract moral principles; it can be very difficult to apply them to a given situation, particularly when it involves the moral character of another person. When one pronounces moral judgment whether in praise or in blame, one must be prepared to answer "Why?" and to prove one's case—to oneself and to any rational inquirer.

So to the statements above, this is how critical thinkers would rephrase them

•        "Everyone has a right to seek the truth."
•        "We should seek the good and reject the evil."
•        "Judge, and be prepared to be judged."

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I refuse to remain impartial between the fire brigade and the fire.
—Winston Churchill

The third-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the majority. The second-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the minority. The first-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking.
—A. A. Milne

Those who choose to not participate in politics will be ruled by their inferiors.
—Plato

Are those who declare "Judge not that ye be not judged" willing to allow others to act immorally so that they may do so also?
—No mercy for the Devil

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"Judge, and be prepared to be judged."

Let's compare that to the Bible.

The bible says "Judge not, least ye be judged" (or words to that effect).

The bible tells you not to judge others because doing so will likely result later in you being judged. We could argue all day long over the nuances and meanings of the word "judge". I am not going to do that. I am just going to assume the meaning that most of us would, when we use the word "judge". It is generally used to mean "analyze". The act of "judging" is the act of "analyzing."

In our society it has become politically correct to say "don't be judgmental." Are they saying "don't be analytical?" No. What they are really saying is "do not criticize." No one is ever going to complain because you give them too many compliments. They mean "do not criticize me."

In the world we live in today, religion is finally being exposed to the same criticism as science and all other human activities. People do judge. They analyze, and if they feel it's warranted, they criticize. That is called thinking and expressing yourself. Everyone judges, it's called thinking. Everyone criticizes when they feel justified, it's called freedom of expression. And, everyone judges their judger, as is their right.

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You say that one risks his personal integrity if he chooses to stand on a particular side of the fence. That is not true. You might end up finding you were wrong. But being wrong does not necessarily mean being dishonest, ergo you can be wrong and still be a man of integrity. The real reason why it is not true is because if you don't choose, you have no integrity. Integrity is the consistent practice of virtues such as honesty, productivity, justice, etc. To practice those, you have to make choices - both moral and practical. In order to be just, you sometimes need to make a choice on whether a person is or is not guilty for say a crime. There is no middle path here. Your end conclusion might be wrong, but if you have seen the evidence, considered it all and if you have found no inconsistency with one of the verdicts, then you can honestly make that verdict without the breach of integrity. You cannot go through life without making choices and judgments. Judge and be prepared to be judged.
—Nikola Novak

Don Firth