RB - Pardon me for getting the date wrong. Sorry about that I am very definitly numerically challenged as you have been witness to more than once.

Mr. Carroll - in spite of your invitation (in another thread) to call you Jim I will continue to addrss you formally because your tone to me is nothing like friendly or helpful. The "live iwth it" comment was unkind.

I was not attempting to be snide or sarcastic. There is so much in these threads that I cannot follow the arguments. Especially when I get into them late and my brain cannot engage at night after work. Maybe it is age, maybe grief, maybe hangover from chemo. I never was clever. All my understanding has been hard won.

And I want to understand exactly what the contention is about. And I want clear definition from a legitimate authority. I am not especially bright. I do need the facts and history spoon fed to me, without having to wade through the bullshit most which appears to divide people with a common interest into camps. I get tired and give up trying to pull meaning from the threads.

I would have preferred a link to the actual definition and historical reference to the principal contributors to that definition. No snide remarks or patronising, pleaxe. Then upon reading and interpretting for myself I will come to my own conclusions. So I will google the apporpriate date (thank you RB) and see what I can find out and decide for myself.

I don't want to cause friction. That is the last thing on what little mind I have left.