The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #127384   Message #2845960
Posted By: Bill D
21-Feb-10 - 02:35 PM
Thread Name: BS: 'Some rape victims should take blame'- ??
Subject: RE: BS: 'Some rape victims should take blame'- ??
Good grief...people are STILL posting as if the question of whether 'rape is ever justified' has not been answered.

Of course rape in never justified! All that is a real issue is 'what defines rape', and THAT is a muddled issue.

Some think it's simply a black/white definition of "any time the woman says NO'. But THAT becomes a matter of controversy. If it was a question of "would you like another chocolate-chip cookie?", it is easy to note various levels of 'NO', but I can easily write scenarios where NO is not clear & unambiguous.....and you can too!
IF you seriously want to define rape, you will have to figure out some way to differentiate quiet, mumbled 'no' from loud, serious NO!....and you must decide whether NO is required, or whether, "...oh, Johnny...I don't we should..." is enough, and decide whether, if she has allowed Johnny many times before, that 'NO' has the same status, and whether she got into bed with Johnny intending to have sex, but decided she was 'too tired' right now, or he had not showered in days and puts her off, or he insulted her sister at the crucial moment.....and 10 million other possible scenarios.

Now...note: I am not condoning anything:::

Yes...it is my opinion, that she...or HE..or any person, should be able to 'opt out' of ANY sexual encounter at ANY time!!

ANYONE should have, and in principle does have, the right to say the equivalent of 'NO' at any point. The real issue is, what level of ignoring various forms of 'NO' are serious enough to call it rape? THIS is why court cases become a matter of "he said/she said" and judges & juries hate to send some testosterone laden kid to jail for seemingly misreading the seriousness of her 'NO'...or whatever she actually said.

It is not a matter of stridently insisting that the principle is simple, the definition is clear, and the rules are universal....
What is needed is a way for society to define those rules as clearly as possible, and as I said 2 or 3 times above, educate kids of BOTH sexes about what the rules mean-- starting as soon as they are able to comprehend the issue.

Sexuality IS an enormously powerful force which does not lend itself easily to simplistic modern rules and legalistic overlays, but modern society does require that we do something to facilitate controls on 'natural urges' in order to protect (mostly) women from trauma, guilt, embarrassment, pain, and lingering problems about their own image....and more.

The issue is real, but we need to be very careful about deciding exactly what the issue actually is.