The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #134159   Message #3051366
Posted By: Joe Offer
11-Dec-10 - 09:14 PM
Thread Name: BS: Virgin of Guadalupe insulted in church
Subject: RE: BS: Virgin of Guadalupe insulted in church
Bee-dubya-ell, Catholics are supposed to honor Mary and the saints. You know, it's kinda like naming rights for a stadium...

The "official" Roman Catholic faith is very much a head-based religion. What's on the books is all very rational and documented and balanced - and in my eight years of seminary training, I was taught what's "on the books" - and it makes a lot of sense to me, although I don't meet a whole lot of Catholics who understand or accept it. Also, I have to say that what's on the books is usually very compassionate, and doesn't cater to the ethnic biases and cruelty and the harshness that is so often present in religion. However, what's on the books often tends to be unrealistic, and often tends not to hear or understand what's in people's hearts.

On the other hand, the "unofficial" Roman Catholic faith is very much a matter of the heart, often leaving reason and logic far behind. It is an instrument of ethnicity, with both the strengths and weaknesses of ethnic backgrounds. It can be rich in folklore and tradition and family history, and it can also harbor ethnic prejudices and superstition and cruelty. Theologically, the "unofficial" Roman Catholic faith is a mess, and is a home for all the pagan beliefs that are in the history of the ethnic groups that call themselves Catholic. No wonder the reformers of the 16th century found fault with the Catholic faith. It's a very, very messy religion.

I'm not sure which side of the fence I stand on. I'm thoroughly Catholic, and 16 years of Catholic education and four decades of supplemental workshops have given me a strong grounding in what the Catholic Church is supposed to be. "Intellectual Catholicism" is where I come from - but I've had a lot of contact with "ethnic Catholicism," and I've learned to respect it without fully understanding it.

So, yeah, I've learned that the Hispanic community has a right to celebrate Our Lady of Guadalupe devotions, even though they seem tacky to my rational mind. And the Polish community has a right to celebrate Divine Mercy devotions, although I question the Americans who have scrubbed away the Polish roots of these devotions and changed them into something rigid and doctrinaire. They even photoshopped out the Polish inscription on the Divine Mercy Icon, replacing it with computer lettering in English.

Benedict XVI (Josef Ratzinger) is very much a Pope of "intellectual Catholicism," and I feel comfortable with him. The highly acclaimed John Paul II (the Great) was a Pope of "ethnic Catholicism," and I didn't understand him and didn't like him.

The Catholic Church is a big mess. It's not rational at all. Maybe that's the way it's supposed to be.

MG, even though I don't completely understand it, I do respect your point of view. I think you are an extraordinary person, and I don't mean to put you down in any way. However, I think the priest in question also has a valid perspective. You need to talk with him, and to search for common ground. I think you'll find it if you look. "Intellectual Catholicism" and "ethnic Catholicism" will always be in conflict, but it can be a constructive conflict if people take the time to listen to each other.

-Joe Offer-