Christian fundamentalism doesn't work for me either, Don T, for reasons similar to what you have posted. It never did work for me, but I grew up as a child in an atheistic family, so it's hardly surprsing that I rejected the entire Christian mythos the moment I encountered it.

Later I began to see much value in many of the philosophical concepts expressed in the Gospels, and those are the main thing about Christianity that I like and find value in. Concepts such as: being forgiving, being loving, being kind, being truthful, being honest, being loyal, being just, etc...

Those are the things I find in Christianity that I like very much. I have no particular interest in the rather odd idea of Jesus dying on behalf of anyone's sins...or being the one and only "Son of God"...but I like what Jesus apparently had to say about human conduct toward other humans and toward life in general.

Most of the Christians I've ever known were not fundamentalists, and most of them believed in modern concepts like evolution, for example. Therefore I don't necessarily see Christianity confined within the shoebox of Christian fundamentalism.

But I am not a Christian. I'm just interested in the more positive aspects of Christianity. Same as I am interested in the positive aspects of Native American religion, Buddhism, Taoism, Sufiism, Islam, Shintoism, Hinduism, etc. They all have some very positive aspects, and some excellent concepts to consider, and that's what interests me about them.

Similarly, all nations and all cultures have some positive aspects, and that's why I am willing to find some good in all nations and all cultures.

To utterly oppose in its entirety any religion, any discipline or any culture and see NO good in it at all... just because you don't subscribe to it is to be a purblind fanatic of a certain sort, and it's a very ugly phenomenon. It is that phenomenon that causes some people to post here just so they can throw verbal rotten eggs at the despised "Christian" who dares to post on their forum. No respect. Well, they live in the ugliness of their own thought processes, just like any fanatic does, and they are no better than a religious fundamentalist who rants and raves and tells us we are all going to hell for not accepting Jesus as our personal saviour.

I am not referring to you in those above comments, Don T., but to a few others who drop in here just to stand around and jeer and throw rocks at the "outsider" like a bunch of little kids bullying a strange kid who entered their schoolyard.

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LEJ - You said: "Science has nothing to do with any presupposition."

Good science has nothing to do with any presupposition. Agreed.

Bad science, however, is based upon and dominated by presuppositions, and there has always been a fair bit of bad science around. Sometimes it dominates the officially sanctioned scene for a period of time. I'll give you a glaring historical example - The Nazis engaged in a great deal of well-funded bad science to prove their fallacious theories about the Aryan "Master Race". That bad science was widely publicized and promoted through the German government and media in the 30s and early 40s, and it was believed by a great many people. It is STILL believed by a few.

The same sort of thing happens now, only it's not the Nazis who are presently doing it, that's all. It's other political and financial forces who are presently doing it, and strictly for their own gain.

It is bad science that worries me...not good science. I am very much in favor of good science...meaning: honest science, without ulterior motives or presuppositions of any sort.