Richard ~ That is still assuming the answer in the question being asked [i.e. 'begging the question'] ~ particularly here in your tendentious usage of 'civilised', as well as the repeated assumption that they must be regarded as 'reforms'. You know this to be true whatever you pretend.

I am anyhow not sure of the accuracy of the statement [letting 'civilised' pass for the moment]. "Can" there not, indeed? Just read the 'Bulger' thread to see how true {not at all!} it may be re the first of the 'reforms' at least. And if you respond that some of the views expressed therein prove their holders not to be 'civilised', then you will be compounding your ?-begging in ♠♠♠, will you not?

~Michael~