I knew about the guns in the cars. To me that is a definition of unarmed, but perhaps people have other definitions. By armed I mean on the body, or perhaps in the car if the officer were in the car too.

What I do not get is that it seems shooting started at 5:10 and police only heard about it at 5:25...

Lots of kids had phones on them..they were trying to call and were not put through by phone operators who were only taking calls (now thisis what I read..I was not there and I can not analyze every bit of information myself..that is what a community is for..international of course)...about the Oslo bombing...something is wrong there..15 minutes, 15 people..someone needs to review that..and they were texting parents etc. The whole phone thing needs to be looked at..did the camp have numbers of local police? Etc...there is a 15 minut delay..OK..12 perhaps..some got away quickly I am sure..and some hid in caves...surely they called and texted..there is a breakdown in the phone response somewhere. I still want to know the boat situation..you have 500 campers it seems..?? someone confirm? Some unheard from probably on advice of lawyers staff..probably some are Olympic quality swimmers, canoists etc..a camp of 500 in an island has to have a bunch of boats.

Shore 200 300 800 meters/yards away...what was staff trained to do and what did they do?

THe only reason so many survived is because of the strong physical fitness they had..we would not be so lucky here..there are many lessons to be learned for educators in this event..mg