I continue to wonder how to talk to "them." "They" are the people who fiercely refuse to live in a fact and reason based reality. This fact and reason based planet has led to virtually all of our real life existence as we know it. That is agriculture, medicine, technology.

"They" choose to repeat ideas which are *not* based in fact or methodical processes. "They" have many different names for their systems of thought, and most of them do not agree in some part with the others. The comparison for these thought systems and their discrepencies can metaphorically be described in "How many angels can dance on the head of a pin."

Since an angel cannot be defined and measured, the question cannot be intelligently investigated. We can never get closer to the truth, much less answer in terms that most people can agree on, or that will demonstrate reproducible results. So it is possible to continue to "discuss" it through the night and 4, 7, 11 beers and start over the next night, and so on without resolving anything or adding to the sum of human knowledge.

Perhaps I am missing the forest for the trees. Perhaps the goal IS perpetual discussion. However, when the discussion leaves the pub, when people want to make public policy or force their views on me, it does become a problem. And I remain clueless as to how to persuade these people to leave fantasy and join the real world.

Saul