The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #145760 Message #3373021
Posted By: Gibb Sahib
06-Jul-12 - 06:38 PM
Thread Name: Shanties as work songs, question
Subject: RE: Shanties as work songs, question
I think it's a good question, Tim, because its one of those things that is taken for granted. Most people, perhaps, don't even think about it, whereas others would just give these speculations based on what they imagine, kind of like the question of harmony in chanties. I am more inclined not to assume, but to see what evidence suggests.
My general sense (without having gone back to look at the evidence in detail, is that it would have varied depending on the style of the chanty. So we can say generally that both were done, i.e. the chantyman not singing the response and the chantyman singing the response, but that statement isn't very enlightening.
For clarity, let's say we will ignore the heaving chanties with a grand chorus. Just talking about those balanced call-response forms.
Beyond the two options (to sing or not sing the response) there is the question of overlap, raised by Glenn and Dead Horse. A true overlap, if it was done, implies that the chantyman did not sing the response -- or else he sang only part of it. I do think the chantyman sometimes sang only part of the response, that that would have been more like "because he felt like it", rather than because he had to sing only part in order to overlap his solo!
I am skeptical of the type of overlap that Dead Horse describes for "Bowline", but mainly because I don't remember seeing any evidence for that style. Its a style where the meter gets "chopped" short. I do know that it has been in fashion now and again with people, but I get the sense that these are people who have read passages like the one Glenn mentions and have interpreted it in their way. I also think it is unlikely because there was no need to keep such a chanty in a continuous rhythm; one could pause after each verse to set up for the next pull. But I'm mainly doubtful because, as I said, I don't remember seeing evidence of this and because I think the overlap mentioned by a couple (?) writers (let us not count the voices of those that are just repeating what they read in earlier books) and can explained differently. That being said, I believe that sort of overlap is plausible, so it comes down just a difference in opinion, I think.
We have hardly any recordings of sailors singing the chanties w/ a chorus along for the recording. One of these is the set with Capt. Leighton Robinson where, most of the time at least, he is singing the responses. Yet we do have a good number of recordings of Caribbean singers of chanties with chorus that, if you accept it, is good evidence. In most/all of these, the chantyman doesn't sing the response; it is a true "call and response." In some cases, the style of the chanty is such that there is much overlap, sometimes not so much. But it is not the sort of overlap that interferes with meter, rather it is because the chorus comes at metronomic regularity with the work, and the soloist is more layered over the top -- not really leading, as Dead Horse suggest. I disagree with DH, however, because I think that is just one of the styles. In other styles, the chantyman *does* lead or cue the crew.
I have more thoughts, but that's some for now.