michael, Steve Shaw said, "Gosh, why not ridicule religion? It's baleful, repressive, dishonest and controlling. And just not true."

In so doing, he automatically stereotyped all religions and all religious people in as unjust and prejudiced a way as someone would who called all black people "worthless niggers". That's why I said what I did.

In the lengthy experience of my life, I have encountered many very good people among both the religious and the nonreligious, at least as many in the one camp as in the other. Most of the religious people I've encountered were entirely rational, DID believe in modern science and evolution, were not repressive, were not baleful, and were not controlling. Quite the contrary. They were looking into improving themselves as compassionate and loving human beings, not controlling someone else.

I've studied the North American Indian Medicine Way (traditional religion), Hinduism, Buddhism, Christianity, Taoism...and to a lesser extent Judaism, Islam, Zoroastrianism, and various other religious traditions.

I encountered many of the best, kindest, most honest and rational and politically progressive people I've ever met amongst those various traditions as well as among atheists and agnostics. The VERY best and most responsible of all the people I've ever met have mostly been those with religious views of some kind, because their social ideals and their sense of personal responsibility and kindness to others was absolutely exemplary...as was their behaviour.

In lumping all religions and religious people together as supposedly "baleful, repressive, dishonest and controlling. And just not true", Steve is condemning a great many very good people about whom he obviously knows little or nothing. He's exhibiting extreme prejudice and erecting a straw man to fling hostile rhetoric at. That's why I said what I said.

It's as if he had heard various bad stuff during his life about...let's say...Jews, and on the basis of that hearsay he said, "Why not ridicule Jews? They're dirty, theiving, and dishonest. They lie and cheat. Everything they do is an abomination."

People wouldn't let somone get away with a statement like that nowadays, would they? And for good reason!

Well, people shouldn't make sweeping statements like that condemning religions and religious people either. It's the height of ignorance and prejudice to do so. Yet you see it constantly on this forum from certain individuals. It's deemed to be okay, apparently, to be deeply prejudiced against the religious...and that is just as dumb and just as wrong as being deeply prejudiced against blacks, women, gays or Jews.