These classically-trained musicians like Goodall tend to be insufferably sure of the superiority of the western classical tradition.Attempts to include folk or popular styles often look either patronising or phoney. Superficially (and I dont think they get beyond that level) it can sound unsophisticated.But as many of us here know, once you get into it - an irish reel,a scottish bagpipe tune - is tremendously sophisticated, but in a different way from Mozart.

Re-reading the thread, I should like to return briefly to this point, particularly with respect to Beethoven. You are absolutely right about the patronising, nominal way that folk music is often included in programmes of this sort. The irony there is that Beethoven (and he wasn't alone by a long chalk) was incredibly respectful of folk music. Not only did he set (somewhat clumsily at times!) a number of Scottish folk songs, which he loved, but he also spent many an hour in local taverns listening to the kinds of pub bands that we still have today. The Pastoral Symphony contains an affectionate reflection of these experiences in the peasants' merrymaking section, as does the sublime second movement of the late quartet in A minor, of all places. There are bagpipe drones and some rather drunk musicians who just about manage to rescue themselves! The late quartet in B flat contains a lovely, original German dance ("alla danza tedesca"), innocent in its simplicity, and the finale of the Op. 127 quartet in E flat (a monument to happy lyricism from start to finish, if ever there was one) contains a solemn yet gay rustic stomp. The Grosse Fuge from the quartet in B flat, tough and sinewy as it is for the most part, contains a little dance in the middle that no dancer of jigs would find strange. Affectionate? Absolutely! Patronising? Not a bit of it! Inward-looking and austere? Come off it, Howard!