The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #149974   Message #3492686
Posted By: Little Hawk
20-Mar-13 - 02:46 PM
Thread Name: BS: What is 'Heaven and Hell'?
Subject: RE: BS: What is 'Heaven and Hell'?
Jack said, "the trick is not to simply accept Christ's forgiveness, but to do so wholeheartedly, and most importantly in light of Gnu's philosophy, sincerely."

EXACTLY!!!

Just to utter a few rote words according to accepted ceremony or tradition means little or nothing. You have to mean it deeply, sincerely, with the full committment of your mind, your heart, your soul, and your whole strength. That takes some considerable thought and hard work...and it usually takes some time to accomplish. It might take weeks, months or years. It isn't just a question of saying in a few short seconds "I accept Jesus Christ as my personal saviour" and then imagining that you are home free from that moment on.

You might fool someone else, you might even fool yourself, but you sure won't fool that which can save you.

string - I don't think consciousness emanates FROM the brain. Not at all. I think it was there before the brain and uses the brain as a receiver. I think it passes THROUGH the brain which serves as an excellent transmittor/receiver (just like a radio receiving a program and transmitting it). The brain is then used to direct that consciousness throughout the rest of the body, via the nervous system. I think consciousness existed long before the body in question, that it helped build the body cell by cell right from the moment of conception, that it maintains the body as long as the body is still alive, and that it survives the body and departs from it when the body dies...and that it continues on to do a great deal more very creative work long after that.

I expect you won't agree with that, because there's no physical proof (for or against what I said). Fine. No problem. We are each expressing whatever we think about the subject, and it's okay if we disagree.

I only demand physical proof of things which are susceptible TO physical proof, and what we're talking about here (heaven, hell, afterlife, soul, etc) is not and cannot be...because it's not anything definable in physical terms. It's not among a list of identifiable physical or energetic items or phenomena in this observable Universe, therefore it can't be examined, proven, or disproven in a physical way...by machinery...through a microscope...in a test tube...etc.

And neither can my love for whatever or whomever I love....but my love is real. And so are a number of other extremely valuable forces/principles/factors in life which no one can ever prove through any measurable phenomena. They are subjective matters, not objective things. They are not found in any outer phenomena, but are experienced inside the human heart, and they are only experienced through our consciousness.

That is what the spiritual search is about: Consciousness. Governance of consciousness. Raising of consciousness. Improving one's consciousness. Turning from hate and fear to love.   Purificatation of consciousness. It is in no way opposed to science, but cooperates fully with science in any situation where science can usefully be applied. No serious spiritual student I've ever known was opposed in any way to science or to the scientific method. I've always believed in science without question. That's what they call a no-brainer. ;-) It's totally obvious that science is a good and useful discipline. I only came to believe in spirituality later, when I realized there was a bunch of other really important stuff in life that science couldn't help me with at all, because science simply has no means of effectively dealing with it. You cannot grasp a moral ideal in a pair of plyers or look at it under a microscope...but without a coherent, loving, and wise set of moral ideals as your foundation for action, you are nothing much more than a dangerous animal.

And we all probably pass people like that on the street every day. What do they believe in? They believe in themselves. Maybe they beieve in money too. Or possessions. They believe in winning. Survival of the fittest. They're "looking out for number 1". And that may be all they care about...because it's all they have yet consented to understand. I call that the equivalent of "walking around dead"...but to them they're just playing what they think is the only game in town. Real love doesn't even exist in that game.