The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #153681   Message #3600488
Posted By: Jack the Sailor
11-Feb-14 - 04:18 PM
Thread Name: BS: Real Non-belief/not militant
Subject: RE: BS: Real Non-belief/not militant
"the pastor mentioned in the article thinks that only religious rules stop he and his flock from being lecherous drunken murderers"

I don't think that he thinks that at all.


the pastor mentioned in the article thinks that only religious rules stop he and his flock from being lecherous drunken murderers

"The pastor wanted his audience to be clear that the resurrection of Jesus wasn't merely some spiritual metaphor. "If the resurrection didn't literally happen," he shouted, "there is no reason for us to be here! If the resurrection didn't literally happen—there are parties to be had! There are women to be had! There are guns to shoot! There are people to shoot!""

I think he was being colorful, rhetorical and metaphorical for sure. But people go to church, especially high tech megachurch, to be entertained as well as enlightened. I think that he also, like many pastors have the incentive to have them awake when the offering plate is passed around.

From the artcle "You caught the subtext? Atheists (and even liberal Christians) have no basis for morality. Nothing—and I mean nothing!—stands between a godless person and debauchery or lechery or even violence. "

I didn't catch that subtext at all. I don't think he was talking to or about "Atheists (and even liberal Christians)" at all. I think he was talking to and about the people in his pews (or comfy stadium seats as the case may be.) He, if you didn't notice, was speaking about himself. What do you think he would say if it was pointed out to him that some atheists don't party, or drink or shoot. He was making the case that Jesus' sacrifice was for himself and for the people in his church. He is implying to his audience that they need that sacrifice to be moral. I happen to believe that one can follow Jesus as a teacher with or without the sacrifice, clearly the Pastor and his flock do not. That's good for them.

Penn and Teller, and those other 23 people on stringsinger's link believe that they have their own way. More power to them. I am glad they have chosen to be moral and to enjoy creation even though they believe it to be a combination of a clockwork journey from energy to entropy beginning with the Big Bang.   I also believe that but I believe there is more to it than just that. I like to call that mystery "God." I'm not harming anyone with my beliefs so I'll stick with them because they do me good.

I also don't think the Pastor is doing any harm in telling his flock to be moral in the way they want to hear it by being colorful, rhetorical and metaphorical.

I don't think by any means that the people in his church believe that all people who do not believe exactly as they do on these issues are partying, gun toting, drunken killers. But it is possible they think that some of their number, including their own selves might be without Jesus.