Traditional marriage has actually served women very badly. Read the article linked to by Peter Laban. Traditional marriage has kept women subservient to their husbands for centuries and much of that quasi-enslavement has been enshrined in law, variously in different countries. Add to that the very high failure rate of marriages, the frequency of domestic abuse, often rampant infidelity and the fact that millions of couples now simply live together (something, oddly, that you are silent on, despite your love for traditional marriage, which calls sharply into question your clear obsession with gay marriage, no?), and traditional marriage is beginning to look, well, a little anaemic to say the least. A bit rocky, eh? I'd say that traditional marriage has served MEN very well...

I agree with most of what Joe Offer says in his last two posts. But I would add my opinion that, if someone utters what I regard to be illiberal and backward views on sexuality, as exemplified by Akenaton and pete's posts, then my right to be pretty vehement (and sod tactics) in response is just as "sacred", to use Joe's terminology. There is a pretty well-justified perception here that they are being protected whilst right-minded, if tactically-deficient, people are being silenced. That's the problem. And I know only too well that you don't have to name-call to get your posts or threads deleted.