Steve: Bravo on your expanded claimancy of things artistic, cathedrals included!

My remark about babies and bathwater was aimed at what I think is the fallacy of material limits--meaning that the right-minded desire for evidence to support assertions gets twisted into the insistence on material evidence of same. The scope of imagination and the dimensions of love and creative thought cannot be defined by material evidence, as such, for example. But there is plenty of evidence they exist, including your cathedrals.

When Joe speaks of the seeking of viewpoints "beyond" he is following a trail of some sort of evidence, and I suppose you could call it spiritual evidence; but you will not find any particles or molecular compounds along the trail.

A