Jimmy, you're dead right on the motives, that's my point. If it's facts being taught in a history lesson, then great. Understand what happened, and don't let it happen again. But if it's just an excuse for xenophobia and passing prejudices down to your children, then enough's enough.

Fiolar, interesting story about Victoria - I can well believe that from her Imperial Majesty. But I'm not sure about McNeice's lines. Pride in what a member of your family has achieved (father/grandfather/whatever) is great - if I had a relative who was a war hero, I'd be proud of him for it. But the implication of the poem (and of this thread) is that ppl of Irish descent should be proud of what was done TO them, and that to me implies too much vendetta.

Grab.