The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #162281   Message #3861580
Posted By: JeffB
18-Jun-17 - 10:36 AM
Thread Name: BS: Baseball Practice Shooting
Subject: RE: BS: Baseball Practice Shooting
Well, Ake, of course hatred for a political leader is ideologically based, almost by definition. But of course you can also hate someone who, for instance, uses a position of power to grope women, or makes racist remarks, or outrageous statements on scientific matters for which he isn't qualified. But I suppose it's possible to hate a leader while respecting his/her policies and vice versa, and perhaps people who have lived under more extreme Left or Right regimes have experienced this.

As I don't live in the USA I don't fully understand your 2nd sentence. Do you mean the US has been weakened militarily as a world power? If so, you seem to be at variance with Mr Trump's own international policy, which in his campaign speeches was consistently non-interventionist. I thought the "Make America Great Again" slogan was about economic revival, and one important part is supposed to be in bringing the big corporations to heel in the matter of tax evasion. "How I love the little guy" was something he said in one speech on the subject. Of course, being part of the 1% who control over 90% of the planet's wealth (perhaps someone has a more exact figure), he himself is part of that problem, but no doubt the little guys who voted for him will push the congressmen/women for early action on tax evasion and will expect to see US trade figures and employment figures going up next year.

I am always a bit baffled by references to "liberals" who are trying to destroy Liberty or the American Way of Life or something like that, which is what I assume you mean by your reference to the unwritten political bible of the liberal left. If it's unwritten and you are not yourself a liberal (I don't know what the opposite is - an authoritarian?) how do you know what it is? You must admit it's always a rather vague accusation. Can you be more specific and define for a Brit (and I have to proudly admit that I regard myself as a "liberal", though apparently not the same sort that you have in mind) just what this destructive liberal Left agenda is? I'm rather disturbed that "liberal" has become a term of abuse in the US, and even more so that it is also becoming an insult here in the UK. Surely liberal ideals should be respected and promoted, not opposed and undermined. I assume that even though you despise "liberals" you also want to uphold the Constitution of the Republic. Personally I think your Constitution is one of the greatest and most important documents ever written, but I have to remind you that it was written by liberals. You can see why I am a little confused.

Mentioning politicians who have little regard for future problems, I think Mr Trump is being accused of just that by pulling out of the Paris Agreement. You might disagree with him on that, so let's not go even more off-thread on climate change, but I'll just say that democratic systems have an in-built flaw by making long-term strategic decisions difficult or even impossible. Non-liberal governments such as China are much more stable and consistent in that regard. I suppose all you can say is that short-term political thinking is one of democracy's downsides.

As to Mrs May's spot of bother lately (and goodness me, we are going way off-thread, but hey-ho, this is Mudcat) I should first of all point out that whatever started the fire at Grenfell Tower it had nothing to do with "liberal policies" or any other political beliefs, at least as far as I can see. The local Conservative Council approved for the building to be clad in inflammable material for cosmetic reasons and did not put a sprinkler system at the top of their refurb programme. No doubt the inevitable, protracted, and completely powerless Public Enquiry will reveal more in time, but for now cladding and sprinklers are established facts. The disaster seems to be more about mistakes made by the local authority than anything else, and try as I might, I can't see any trace of either liberal or conservative policies there. Perhaps that just underlines that I don't really understand what (some) Americans mean when they talk about "liberal" values.

I do agree that Mrs May is getting undeserved flak over the tragedy. What a London borough decides to do in refurbishing its housing, or how a major disaster is handled, is really a matter for the local authorities, not central government. As a Labour voter, I do think that the (Labour) Mayor of London has some questions to answer, but so far he seems to have been able to duck responsibility. But then, I'm not a Londoner and haven't been following events very closely, so perhaps I've missed something.