I think what we are saying is that clubs in general are not in a mess, Jim. Ones like you used to run and attend all those years ago may no longer exist but they have been superseded by something different and, quite possibly, better. Those new clubs, the ones that are more acceptant of a looser definition of folk music, are thriving. The ones described in the opening post may be in decline, and rightly so, but the better ones either pull floor singers up with them or restrict the poor ones to times where they do least damage!

DtG