The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #165445   Message #3969534
Posted By: Jim Carroll
03-Jan-19 - 06:55 AM
Thread Name: traditional songs - best for learning?
Subject: RE: traditional songs - best for learning?
"It seems to me that Steve's 31 Dec 18 - 09:08 AM post also offered some very plausible explanations"
I responded to that Richard - our recordings offer the equally valuable, if not more so, chance to hear Walter talking at hi songs at length and of how he regards traditional songs in comparison to his non- traditional songs
I would point out that, apart from Walter's recordings, the British Library hold masses of recording of our Traveller songs, stories, lore and information, Clare Songs, and other Norfolk songs recorded in Winterton, none of which have been recorded elsewhere - all locked away along with Walters
It can hardly be claimed that they are of no interest to the National Sound Archive as such material is available in the Kennedy collection and was recorded at great length by the BBC
I believe our collection was a victim of its own success - Lucy Duran raved about it and her enthusiasm led to the widening of the NSA's brief and began to include British material big-time
The fact that nobody else seems to want our's, Terry Yarnell's or many the other collections says what needs to be said about the current state of Folk Song in England

The NSA holds a full set of the recordings made by Percy Grainger in 1908 - landmark Traditional English recordings - unavailable.
We have a full set given to us by a friend who was given them by Grainger's widow, Ella Grainger
The BBC field recordings are held in full by the Vaughan Williams Memorial Library - as far as I know, they are unavailable for general use.
Instead, E.F.D.S.S. chooses to proioritise poor new compositions which, in my opinion, have nothing to do with folk song
For me, all this is an indication of the poor state of the revival in Britain

"It's a little unfortunate that Andy's appeal for advice about material has been intermittently sidetracked,"
You think so ?
I and others have offered copies of the Song Carriers and I directly offered a digitised set of Caedmon's 'Folk Songs of England' - along with anything from our substantial archive as with many other offers I have made here and on threads such as this, my offers have never been responded to, though I would have thought they were of far more practical use than lists of songs

My first suggestions were practical ones -I have been following this thread and many more have sprung to mind, but the hostility I have received makes me reluctant to be bothered making them - I'm getting rather tired of it all, to be honest

I don't share your opinion of "the common love of the material" still exists - that seems to have long departed from the scene and replaced by an open hostility towards "long, inappropriate
ballads' and by mawkish non-folk Victorian tear-jerkers and early pop songs (anything rather than the real thing)
A love and understanding of traditional songs and an acknowledgement of their social importance and uniqueness is, I believe, essential to their survival

The fact that we can't even discuss the definition of our songs and, when we try, the ear becomes thick with cries of "purist" and "elitist" and "folk police/fascist" says what needs to be noted (and heeded)

These arguments never fail to depress me - luckily, I now live in a place where the traditional arts are treated with pride and respect for their uniqueness, importance and their enjoyment value
Because of this, have been guaranteed a future - would that this was the case back home
Sadly
Jim