The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #165660   Message #3983515
Posted By: Jim Carroll
21-Mar-19 - 04:50 AM
Thread Name: UK 60s Folk Club Boom?
Subject: RE: UK 60s Folk Club Boom?
"the Lloyd Griffith's version."
Which is every bit as unfolky and uninterpreted as the former one
A clever-clever intrusive guitar display accompanied by hiccoughy-delivered words which are delivered without a a shred of interpretation or emotion - a skillful piece of musical dexterity - not a song - as far as you can get from the emotionally filled narrative stories that make up our folk repertoire as you can get
It is certainly not unpleasant, far more pleasurable than the musical-soup immersed stuff that Dave put up, but it bears no resemblance to any folk song I know
Dave has failed miserably to place hi claims next to - perhaps you can place that next to a traditionally rendered piece it in any way resembles ?

The thing that strikes me about all the stuff that is being claimed as being folk coincides with the reason I walked away from pop song if that IT IS ALL SO BORINGLY LIMITED
They are virtually all humourless and plotless - more often than not, nameless, faceless, jobless, interest-less non-people whingeing about failed relationships, or couples whose world doesn't extend beyond each other.... very little else.
It doesn't matter too much what they are about because the instruments, if they don't actually drown out the words, render any plots the songs may have totally irrelevant - these songs are designed for the listener to listen to the music
Occasionally - very occasionally, a song extends beyond this and puts up a cardboard world resembling a poorly constructed set from an early film noire - no place, no people, no life, nothing - DULL-DULL-DULL

Our folk songs are diametrically the opposite - love yes, but usually directly linked to other aspects of life, parting, but yes, but usually far more than some feller running of with your girlfriend - far more likely to be about being pressed to sea, or social misalliance, or lack of a job, or war..... real situations

I don't see a great deal of real humour in your songs - no funny stories like The Tailor's Britches, or The Old Drover, or The Ranter Parson... or the many, many more humourous pieces that make up the folk repertoire
No cleverness such as that found in The Penny Wager or The Crafty Farmer
No excitement that even approaches the epic Farmer Michael Hayes, or The Rambling Royal
No real tragedy except losing your girl or feller, which is basically the only thing to be identified with in the pop repertoire   
No real sexual encounters, no eroticism, so seduction - if there is sex, it's penisless and fannyless - sex with no balls
Certainly there are certainly no substantial stories to the substitutes you are offering to folk songs -
The plots of the ballads are as exciting and absorbing as anything in literature - from Shakespeare to modern novels and plays - good films.
Your songs are to be sung at people - they certainly don't invite you to be part of them - little more than musical sounds

We used to have occasional evenings in the Singers Club entitled 'You Name It, We Sing It' where the audience was asked to pass up subjects for songs rather than requests
The idea was that the subjects were referred to, which then referred to to an existing song - or even just a random topic
Only the singer with large repertoires participated - I can never remember them being stymied - nearly on one occasion when someone wrote on the slip "unpaid brickie goes berserk and slays two" - Bert Lloyd eventually obliged with Lamkin

Al Whittle described the folk repertoire as dull "and some of us prefer colours other than rustic sepia"
Quite honestly, I can't think of anything as dull as the monotone, peopleless, plotless stuff you people are putting up as an alternative to folk song
Jim Carroll