The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #166730   Message #4013324
Posted By: Jim Carroll
13-Oct-19 - 04:11 AM
Thread Name: the uk folk revival in 2019
Subject: RE: the uk folk revival in 2019
"if he is using folk styles he is doing what contemporary folk song writer do!
That depends on the writer and the song he/she created"
I was referring to MacColl, of course - 300 plus known composed songs and god knows how many forgotton ones (according to his widow)
The term "folk" has been made so meaningless by (often deliberate) misuse that many of today's folk composers imitate non-folk styles anyway (Ed Shearan and Ray Davis's names have come up, for instance)
MacColl sang his own songs , but he sang far more traditional ones - (he breathed fresh life into around 140 Child Ballads), so it was inevitable that the two would merge

"Intended audience" was the last thing that influenced his songwriting - the subject matter was the be-all and end-all of all his creations - he made songs because he felt the necessity to say something - as I believe all those anonymous people who made our folk-songs did who made our folk-songs
His best songs (in my opinion) were made by taking recorded actuality from the people the songs were about and using the information and language to create new songs - Sam Larner, Ronnie Balls, Ben Bright, Jack Hamilton, Jack Elliot,,,,
It was this technique, not MacColl's folkness that made the songs the great compositions that they were
I know MacColl rejected the description 'Folk song writer' because he said it often enough in my company - he considered it important
He also considered it important that new songs were created using the old models if the revival was going to mean anything other than being a museum for old songs.

"No no traditional and folk song are not the same"
You can repeat this until your arse drops off, but until you explain yourself and prove it to be the case it will never be more than a denial.
I've shown you mine - now it's your turn to show me yours Ray

Your starter for ten:
Why are they not the two sides of the same coin ?
"Folk" refers to the social group that probably made them, identified with them, and took ownership of them as being 'local' or Norfolk' or 'family' songs
"Traditional" refers to the way they were manipulated and adapted to suit the particular singers and their communities - the journey they take from their original composer(s) through their existence

Jim