I go back in folk clubs to 1965. In all of the clubs I regularly visited and there were plenty of different types then, some much more contemporary others very traditional every one was a mixture of what we called traditional folk and contemporary folk. Not one club was completely traditional, not one club was completely contemporary. I don't see any difference in the clubs I visit today, or in the many singarounds and sessions I attend.

Jim's visit to ONE club in London, snap, I went to a club in the same venue to launch one of my books. Lots of great singing but ONE person stood up with a phone and made a bollox of a song everyone there knew backwards. An unfortunate experience in one club doesn't really tell us very much.

As for people sitting in front of a folder singing from it. Tolerated for a while in a singaround but certainly not encouraged and very much a minority anyway. I've not seen it done in a folk club, but they must exist somewhere as they have been mentioned on here. In all the folk events I have attended in the past 10 years compared with the 60s I'd say a definite improvement, but then again surely that is to be expected with increased knowledge, technology, access to a wide variety of material. And the youngsters are there and taking control and doing a damn good job, but what would he know about this anyway?