I have refined my earlier thoughts and now try to put it all in perspective:

"Mudcat is a bit of a mess right now"....yeah, and probably always will be in many ways..but where else will I go?

"My house is a bit of a mess right now"....yeah, and probably always will be in many ways..but where else will I go?

"My country is a bit of a mess right now"...yeah, and probably always will be in many ways..but where else will I go?

"The world is a bit of a mess right now"...yeah, and probably always will be in many ways..but where else will I go?

"The internet/WWW is a bit of a mess right now"...yeah, and probably always will be in many ways..but where else will I go to do what can be done here?

do we detect a pattern here?...Can we TRY to do the best we can to just be reasonable people and make all of these a little better? This means, in my view, EVERYONE trying to tone down the things they do that irritate othes. Less bitching from trolls and 'guests'..less *TRULY** BS from those who tend toward it. More use of PRIVATE MESSAGES for stuff which does not interest the group as a whole.

You can supply other ideas easily. I also agree with several others that separate, parallel forums for chat and music would help....but...*shrug*...(heck...I want separate forums for traditional music and all that 'other stuff', but I am a purist-snob *grin*)

still...we have an upgrade coming and this forum AS IT IS is wonderful....I am truly sorry that some people cannot adjust to the vagaries that prevail in a free and open forum: I miss some of the departed ones a lot.

Not a lot else to say...........